I am new at it and find it incredibly hard. did you watch the videos on the Vasa site yet? those were helpful. I am on setting 2 or 3, but 3 is probably ambitious I have only done sets of either 100 meters or 150 meters thus far. Curious to hear the response of other people that are more experienced.
New trial member here, and first post in the forums so thanks in advance for all the info that's available here!
I've been tempted for a while to pick up a Vasa, and this discussion is sort of cementing my decision. I'm torn, however, on which model to get based on space availability. Here are. a couple of pics of the room I'd put it in.
Option one is a regular SwimErg set alongside the elliptical (first pic). That space is 13' 6' long and the sloped ceiling is 7' at it's high point and 3.5' at it's low point. Would a regular SwimErg with monorail fit in that space and be usable, or is that too cramped? The elliptical could be moved over to give some more width.
Option two is the space saver version mounted on the wall where the little console is, (second pic) with the bench being where the yoga mat currently sits. I've got 14' length there.
So I guess I have two questions: Will the regular SwimErg be usable in the space under the sloped ceiling, and if I went with the space saver how much functionality am I losing by having the fixed bench?
Nice workout space! The erg is big, like 8ft long. It will fit fine with sloped ceiling
Thank you very much! I'm still getting it all set up. I need a larger fan before I try an FTP test on the trainer. I appreciate the feedback on fitting the Vasa in.
I wanted to post here my first few observations from my use of the Vasa. I have had it for less than a week, but have put in 4 workouts so far. I haven't done anything besides just steady pulling for a couple of reasons. One, I feel like I need to build a little more functional strength before I get too fancy, and two, I haven't fully figured out how to do intervals just yet. My takeaways from my four sessions is this: 1. I miss flip turns. 2. Like, I really miss flip turns. As a relatively strong swimmer I think I have been working under the idea that my muscular strength was "good enough". A few sessions on the Vasa have shown me that I could use some more refinement. The turns would serve to break up the constant use of the shoulders and back. Vasa doesn't give that break. I know this will make me stronger in the long run and I am good with it, but it is funny just how long a session can feel when the muscles start to get tired. 3. I find the vasa has helped me focus on things that I don't do as well in the pool (likely because I am focused on breathing, counting laps, etc.). The best example of this I can point out is truly finishing the pull. It appears I am a bit lazy with this and cut my stroke short. So far on the vasa I have been able to devote the mental space to focusing on it. 4. I have been playing with the damper door settings. When I read that a 1 or 2 is like swimming with the current, I decided to start at 4. For my first session, I was able to hang with that, thought it really got tough (and my first session was less than 20 minutes). The next day I was sore and backed it off. I have mostly worked at 2. Today I was planning a longer session, so I went all the way down to 1. I believe I will have to do a lot more work to get up to the legit settings on the door, but can certainly feel the work now even at the lighter settings.
So what's next? I am still targeting a couple more weeks of this type of work to just build my strength up. After that I am curious to try things that are a bit more complicated. I would love to hear from some that have done the more complicated work about how they went about it. Specifically I am looking at things like sets that target SPM, power, and pace per 100. Basically what are some effective ways to address each of those and how do I specifically program that into the vasa?
I would be happy to answer questions other have, so post away. I would love this to be a space where we all can pick up some things (except Ian as he likely already has a PhD in all things Vasa!)
New trial member here, and first post in the forums so thanks in advance for all the info that's available here!
I've been tempted for a while to pick up a Vasa, and this discussion is sort of cementing my decision. I'm torn, however, on which model to get based on space availability. Here are. a couple of pics of the room I'd put it in.
Option one is a regular SwimErg set alongside the elliptical (first pic). That space is 13' 6' long and the sloped ceiling is 7' at it's high point and 3.5' at it's low point. Would a regular SwimErg with monorail fit in that space and be usable, or is that too cramped? The elliptical could be moved over to give some more width.
Option two is the space saver version mounted on the wall where the little console is, (second pic) with the bench being where the yoga mat currently sits. I've got 14' length there.
So I guess I have two questions: Will the regular SwimErg be usable in the space under the sloped ceiling, and if I went with the space saver how much functionality am I losing by having the fixed bench?
Thanks, John
Hey John,
That looks like a very nice workout area. Judging by the size of some of your other equipment in the room, it looks like the Vasa would fit well under the drop ceiling area. Worst case scenario is that you had to rearrange the set up, but I feel pretty confident that the non space-saving version would fit well in your room.
4. I have been playing with the damper door settings. When I read that a 1 or 2 is like swimming with the current, I decided to start at 4. For my first session, I was able to hang with that, thought it really got tough (and my first session was less than 20 minutes). The next day I was sore and backed it off. I have mostly worked at 2. Today I was planning a longer session, so I went all the way down to 1. I believe I will have to do a lot more work to get up to the legit settings on the door, but can certainly feel the work now even at the lighter settings.
So what's next? I am still targeting a couple more weeks of this type of work to just build my strength up. After that I am curious to try things that are a bit more complicated. I would love to hear from some that have done the more complicated work about how they went about it. Specifically I am looking at things like sets that target SPM, power, and pace per 100. Basically what are some effective ways to address each of those and how do I specifically program that into the vasa?
Thanks for adding your feedback. I think your early experience is pretty typical. Keep at it, and the adaptations will occur - typically in about a month or so. It won't be long before hour long sessions will become no big deal.
I would say that for most people, DD1 is the easy setting, and DD2 is average or "par". I spend most of my time between DD2-4. Very rarely do I use DD5-7. I think it is a bit ambitious for you to start at DD4 - I would suggest DD2 at most, and have no hesitation to use DD1 exclusively during your adaptation period.
In regards to how to "best" use the Vasa... that is definitely a moving target, and certainly contingent upon one's personal objectives. I would suggest you dig into this thread and the one that Mariah started as there are links to specific workouts I posted on google sheets, and a slowtwitch thread that I found pretty useful. There is also a sketch for how to perform a "vasa ftp" test if you want to try create some power based workouts. I got plenty of benefits just converting conventional swim workouts to vasa - either by distance or time. Lately, I have been applying a "redmist" type progression to various distance sets, increasing the DD over the course of the workout, trying to hold a consistent cadence and/or power. Rob Sleamaker (CEO of Vasa) mentioned to me recently that they are close to releasing a beta version of organized progressive Vasa specific workouts. I've been asking him to create something along these lines for over 2 years. I'll keep you posted if I hear more.
I have joined the VASA bandwagon. Looking to change up something with my swimming. Several coaches, various masters groups - 6 IM - pretty close to all same swims.
Thankfully I live close enough to the WSM - @Jenn Edwards and @MarkEdwards for a private lesson. Anyway - I did a whopping 25 min last night and know what I felt most - afterwards - my QUADs. During was feeling in the proper places but man felt those legs on the stairs. Just thought I'd chime in and say thanks for all the information here so far! Looking forward to sharing/learning more.
My Vasa arrived today! Jubal and Ian - thanks for the input on the size of the unit. It fit perfectly in the area where the sloped roof is.
After assembling it and getting my Garmin Edge 820 paired to it and creating a new "Vasa" profile, I hopped on and gave it a try. To say that it was a humbling experience is putting it mildly. I knew I was a weak swimmer at the best of times, and I haven't been in the water at all lately, but holy cow that was hard! The best I could muster was 5 x 100m before I was totally gassed. First three intervals were at DD2 and then I dropped it to DD1 just to get in a couple more intervals.
Everyone talks about how time-efficient this thing is, but I think that this is especially true for weak swimmers like me (if there are any other swimmers as weak as me). The ROI on spending 15-20 minutes to drive down to the pool and then another 30 minutes showering and driving home... all for 30 minutes at best in the water before I'm toast- that's a LOT of wasted time. On this thing, I can hop on, get in several intervals, hop over to the yoga mat and do some core work or hop on the bike... there's no excuse to not be getting in a quick workout on the Vasa every day. BTW - the data imported perfectly into Training Peaks (don't laugh). It's pretty obvious that I can't even muster 100m without power, pace and cadence dropping off pretty drastically by the end of the interval. Nothing but upside here, folks!
Glad this thread is going, keep posting... I found the VASA workouts so effective, they were hurting my next swim or two as my muscles were recovering. Given that I have IMKY in 2+ weeks, I put the VASA on hold until after KY. Then I plan on doing 2-3 wko's a week on it and buiilding up from there.
Well......never in a million years would I have imagined this happening but the left cord broke on my Vasa ERG last night.
I have owned mine since October of 2014 and have used in very consistently since that time. I've reached out to Vasa this morning and hope it's a minor fix.
So.....it's back to the Strechcordz until it gets resolved. I'll keep you guys posted.....
@Todd Braythat sucks. I'm interested in their response and the repair procedure. I noticed last week that one of my cords has a flat spot that I am afraid will start fraying & may soon be in the same position as you are.
@Todd Bray - I had this happen to me earlier this year. Customer service was great, and they sent me a replacement quickly. It is an easy fix. Total downtime was about a week.
Here's the update and resolution to my broken drive cord.
I spoke with the folks at Vasa this morning and they were great!! Apparently, the rewind and drive cords should be replaced every 2-3 years (or obviously when they break). I was unaware of this service issue and have some new ones on the way. A new kit is $30 and they've shipped it out promptly.
According to Karen, the rewind cords fatigue over time and a fresh kit will increase the responsiveness on the machine. If your rewind cords start to feel slow or sluggish on returns then it's probably time for a fresh kit.
Just finished a workout on the VASA - Love/Hated it.
Set it up as a Garmin Bike workout with a repeat .031 as the distance(50Meters), then recovery of 10 seconds - 40 repeats. this way I didn't need to watch the VASA screen just got to listen for a 5 beep count down - hard for me to see plus tend to slow down watching it count down. I can only do 50 yards on this baby before running out of steam - 10 seconds rest.
For those of you about questions on the Vasa, I thought these two pictures might help. I have been using the versa as a tool for adding swim volume to my regimen and hopes ever just the cost of the swim. The jury is out as to whether or not it will make me actually faster in the water, particularly the ocean swims of Hawaii, but there’s no doubt that my stroke rate is higher and I pushing more watts.
The first one above is Red mist - 10 x 400 as 4/3/2/1 from easy to hard, moving damper door from 1 (first 4) to 4 (for the last one).
The next three screenshots below are my progression swimming a steady 2 miles on the Vasa which is my way to get a solid workout done in just under an hour. Almost 10 minutes of improvement!
@Ian Kurth @Jenn Edwards @Coach Patrick Hello all...just checking in! Ian/Jenn/Coach P - I personally blame the 3 of you for what just happened! New Vasa ERG arrived yesterday and set up in the Cass pad. Now Julian and I just need to figure out what to do with the new toy! Going to scroll through the few threads out there. The one thing I am not sure I have seen is how to make sure you have good form on the trainer.....expect Vasa show this on their youtube videos?
Exciting @Dawn Cass I’m sure others will chime in but I happen to have a poster right in front of my VASA that I can see my reflection in. Try to keep my elbows above a certain line in the image. Works for me. YMMV! Enjoy the pain.
Awesome to hear @Dawn Cass! One of the vasa videos does talk about good form that has helped me from a mental cue perspective. They talk about keeping the hand high and closing your arm pit basically. I am not doing it justice but it really helps me keep focus on good catch. It is a great tool, but be prepared to be humbled! I thought I was a pretty good swimmer and that made me feel like a super weakling for the first few weeks.
@Jenn Edwards Thanks Jenn...that's a good idea...will look to copy. We actually have a spare mirror that I was thinking would do the job as well. It feels like there is a bigger opportunity to get the wrong form so I want to make sure I am doing it right. @Scott Giljum I watched the first vasa video and found it extremely helpful. I know there are others out there so will take your suggestion and go through them. It was fantastic to just pop downstairs for 10 minutes today and have a go...no admin at all. Let's see how these muscles feel tomorrow!
Although I'm in maintenance mode and focusing on run training right now, I decided to get a VASA ERG to spend the year strengthening my swim prior to returning to the team and doing multisport races end of 2018 (1/2 IM and swim/run!).
My main observations...I love it...and its hard! Based on everyones advice I'm starting slowly. Mostly 100 yd intervals interspersed with core exercises. My first week I did 2000 yds total over 4 workouts, and my first workout this week I did 1000 yds.
I'm just starting the January OS. Looking at the OS core and swim prep routine, I'm thinking of substituting the swimcordz exercises with Vasa strength work using the training strength straps. Anyone here with a swimerg using the training strength straps to supplement erg work on the Vasa. any tips to share? I have the forearm cuffs. is it better to use these vs. the paddles?
@David Howard - yes, I have the forearm straps. I think that they are helpful and provide a "different" experience. I find that they definitely make me access my lats much more efficiently. With the paddles, there is the possibility to "cheat" and use your rear deltoids, which over time tend to fatigue much faster than the larger muscles of your back. The forearm straps do help ingrain this distinction, and help pattern the larger muscle activation.
@Dave Gardner - Welcome! Great to hear. Once through the adaptation period that everyone must endure, I think you will find good benefit.
@John Katsoudas - I would totally recommend integrating the Vasa in exchange for swim cord usage. No comparison. I think integrating a mix of the forearm straps and paddles is probably the best combo.
Thanks Ian. I threw in some single-arm catches on the Vasa with the cuffs yesterday as part of my core/strength routine. It's a killer workout, and the forearm cuffs definitely reinforce technique as well.
@Ian Kurth and John....interesting about the forearm cuffs...I may think about that. I am still a newbie on the vasa... now up to 1,000m per session after about 3-4 weeks of using. I don’t feel however I am actually using my lats. I am never sore after a workout so I wonder...shouldn’t I be? Then I question if I actually engaging the right muscles. I have watched all the vasa videos so I think I know what should be done....perhaps the forearm cuffs could help reinforce?
@Dawn Cass - the forearm cuffs might help you then... I would also give @Coach Patrick 's podcast with Vasa's Rob Sleamaker a listen as I thought that Rob did a nice job dissecting the components of the stroke and describing the importance of an aggressive acceleration through the back portion of the stroke and ultimately stroke finish.
Comments
I am on setting 2 or 3, but 3 is probably ambitious
I have only done sets of either 100 meters or 150 meters thus far. Curious to hear the response of other people that are more experienced.
I've been tempted for a while to pick up a Vasa, and this discussion is sort of cementing my decision. I'm torn, however, on which model to get based on space availability. Here are. a couple of pics of the room I'd put it in.
Option one is a regular SwimErg set alongside the elliptical (first pic). That space is 13' 6' long and the sloped ceiling is 7' at it's high point and 3.5' at it's low point. Would a regular SwimErg with monorail fit in that space and be usable, or is that too cramped? The elliptical could be moved over to give some more width.
Option two is the space saver version mounted on the wall where the little console is, (second pic) with the bench being where the yoga mat currently sits. I've got 14' length there.
So I guess I have two questions: Will the regular SwimErg be usable in the space under the sloped ceiling, and if I went with the space saver how much functionality am I losing by having the fixed bench?
Thanks,
John
1. I miss flip turns.
2. Like, I really miss flip turns. As a relatively strong swimmer I think I have been working under the idea that my muscular strength was "good enough". A few sessions on the Vasa have shown me that I could use some more refinement. The turns would serve to break up the constant use of the shoulders and back. Vasa doesn't give that break. I know this will make me stronger in the long run and I am good with it, but it is funny just how long a session can feel when the muscles start to get tired.
3. I find the vasa has helped me focus on things that I don't do as well in the pool (likely because I am focused on breathing, counting laps, etc.). The best example of this I can point out is truly finishing the pull. It appears I am a bit lazy with this and cut my stroke short. So far on the vasa I have been able to devote the mental space to focusing on it.
4. I have been playing with the damper door settings. When I read that a 1 or 2 is like swimming with the current, I decided to start at 4. For my first session, I was able to hang with that, thought it really got tough (and my first session was less than 20 minutes). The next day I was sore and backed it off. I have mostly worked at 2. Today I was planning a longer session, so I went all the way down to 1. I believe I will have to do a lot more work to get up to the legit settings on the door, but can certainly feel the work now even at the lighter settings.
So what's next? I am still targeting a couple more weeks of this type of work to just build my strength up. After that I am curious to try things that are a bit more complicated. I would love to hear from some that have done the more complicated work about how they went about it. Specifically I am looking at things like sets that target SPM, power, and pace per 100. Basically what are some effective ways to address each of those and how do I specifically program that into the vasa?
I would be happy to answer questions other have, so post away. I would love this to be a space where we all can pick up some things (except Ian as he likely already has a PhD in all things Vasa!)
That looks like a very nice workout area. Judging by the size of some of your other equipment in the room, it looks like the Vasa would fit well under the drop ceiling area. Worst case scenario is that you had to rearrange the set up, but I feel pretty confident that the non space-saving version would fit well in your room.
Good luck, and welcome aboard!
Ian
Thanks for adding your feedback. I think your early experience is pretty typical. Keep at it, and the adaptations will occur - typically in about a month or so. It won't be long before hour long sessions will become no big deal.
I would say that for most people, DD1 is the easy setting, and DD2 is average or "par". I spend most of my time between DD2-4. Very rarely do I use DD5-7. I think it is a bit ambitious for you to start at DD4 - I would suggest DD2 at most, and have no hesitation to use DD1 exclusively during your adaptation period.
In regards to how to "best" use the Vasa... that is definitely a moving target, and certainly contingent upon one's personal objectives. I would suggest you dig into this thread and the one that Mariah started as there are links to specific workouts I posted on google sheets, and a slowtwitch thread that I found pretty useful. There is also a sketch for how to perform a "vasa ftp" test if you want to try create some power based workouts. I got plenty of benefits just converting conventional swim workouts to vasa - either by distance or time. Lately, I have been applying a "redmist" type progression to various distance sets, increasing the DD over the course of the workout, trying to hold a consistent cadence and/or power. Rob Sleamaker (CEO of Vasa) mentioned to me recently that they are close to releasing a beta version of organized progressive Vasa specific workouts. I've been asking him to create something along these lines for over 2 years. I'll keep you posted if I hear more.
Thankfully I live close enough to the WSM - @Jenn Edwards and @MarkEdwards for a private lesson.
After assembling it and getting my Garmin Edge 820 paired to it and creating a new "Vasa" profile, I hopped on and gave it a try. To say that it was a humbling experience is putting it mildly. I knew I was a weak swimmer at the best of times, and I haven't been in the water at all lately, but holy cow that was hard! The best I could muster was 5 x 100m before I was totally gassed. First three intervals were at DD2 and then I dropped it to DD1 just to get in a couple more intervals.
Everyone talks about how time-efficient this thing is, but I think that this is especially true for weak swimmers like me (if there are any other swimmers as weak as me). The ROI on spending 15-20 minutes to drive down to the pool and then another 30 minutes showering and driving home... all for 30 minutes at best in the water before I'm toast- that's a LOT of wasted time. On this thing, I can hop on, get in several intervals, hop over to the yoga mat and do some core work or hop on the bike... there's no excuse to not be getting in a quick workout on the Vasa every day. BTW - the data imported perfectly into Training Peaks (don't laugh). It's pretty obvious that I can't even muster 100m without power, pace and cadence dropping off pretty drastically by the end of the interval. Nothing but upside here, folks!
I have owned mine since October of 2014 and have used in very consistently since that time. I've reached out to Vasa this morning and hope it's a minor fix.
So.....it's back to the Strechcordz until it gets resolved. I'll keep you guys posted.....
I spoke with the folks at Vasa this morning and they were great!! Apparently, the rewind and drive cords should be replaced every 2-3 years (or obviously when they break). I was unaware of this service issue and have some new ones on the way. A new kit is $30 and they've shipped it out promptly.
According to Karen, the rewind cords fatigue over time and a fresh kit will increase the responsiveness on the machine. If your rewind cords start to feel slow or sluggish on returns then it's probably time for a fresh kit.
As @Ian Kurth mentioned, GREAT customer service!!
Set it up as a Garmin Bike workout with a repeat
.031 as the distance(50Meters), then recovery of 10 seconds - 40 repeats.
this way I didn't need to watch the VASA screen just got to listen for a 5 beep count down - hard for me to see plus tend to slow down watching it count down.
I can only do 50 yards on this baby before running out of steam - 10 seconds rest.
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/2017799204
I believe the Vasa can be pre-programmed similarly, but I'm not sure how easy it is to set up.
The first one above is Red mist - 10 x 400 as 4/3/2/1 from easy to hard, moving damper door from 1 (first 4) to 4 (for the last one).
The next three screenshots below are my progression swimming a steady 2 miles on the Vasa which is my way to get a solid workout done in just under an hour. Almost 10 minutes of improvement!
Work works!!!
@Jenn Edwards
@Coach Patrick
Hello all...just checking in! Ian/Jenn/Coach P - I personally blame the 3 of you for what just happened! New Vasa ERG arrived yesterday and set up in the Cass pad. Now Julian and I just need to figure out what to do with the new toy! Going to scroll through the few threads out there. The one thing I am not sure I have seen is how to make sure you have good form on the trainer.....expect Vasa show this on their youtube videos?
Thanks Jenn...that's a good idea...will look to copy. We actually have a spare mirror that I was thinking would do the job as well. It feels like there is a bigger opportunity to get the wrong form so I want to make sure I am doing it right. @Scott Giljum I watched the first vasa video and found it extremely helpful. I know there are others out there so will take your suggestion and go through them. It was fantastic to just pop downstairs for 10 minutes today and have a go...no admin at all. Let's see how these muscles feel tomorrow!
Although I'm in maintenance mode and focusing on run training right now, I decided to get a VASA ERG to spend the year strengthening my swim prior to returning to the team and doing multisport races end of 2018 (1/2 IM and swim/run!).
My main observations...I love it...and its hard! Based on everyones advice I'm starting slowly. Mostly 100 yd intervals interspersed with core exercises. My first week I did 2000 yds total over 4 workouts, and my first workout this week I did 1000 yds.
Slow and steady-
@Dave Gardner - Welcome! Great to hear. Once through the adaptation period that everyone must endure, I think you will find good benefit.
@John Katsoudas - I would totally recommend integrating the Vasa in exchange for swim cord usage. No comparison. I think integrating a mix of the forearm straps and paddles is probably the best combo.
and John....interesting about the forearm cuffs...I may think about that. I am still a newbie on the vasa... now up to 1,000m per session after about 3-4 weeks of using. I don’t feel however I am actually using my lats. I am never sore after a workout so I wonder...shouldn’t I be? Then I question if I actually engaging the right muscles. I have watched all the vasa videos so I think I know what should be done....perhaps the forearm cuffs could help reinforce?