Ross Randolph Official Coach Thread
Here's your personal Coach Thread, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This first post is here to guide you through your first year on EN, so you can always come back here.
As you'll see in this forum, I handle all manner of edits and changes. So post away, know that I reply here usually M/W/F each week.
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Your Notes
Over 15 marathons - most recent was CIM in 2016 with a 3:08 finishing time. Also 2 full Ironmans (Boulder in 2014 and Frankfurt in 2015) but finished poorly - GI issues on both; would like to get back to someday be competitive at Iron distance but for now focusing on 70.3. Multiple 70.3, most recently 2017 Santa Rosa (4:58) and 2017 Oceanside (5:07). Have been sidelined off & on past 2 years with some nagging injury - mainly Achilles but also every once in a while calf strain & quad issues (left side mainly). Strong swimmer (usually Top 5-10 in my AG out of the water), pretty good runner; horrible on the bike. Will be purchasing a power meter this fall and looking for improvements. Also doing more strength training but doesn't seem to keep me from getting injured. My occupation is a plant manager and work for a Nutrition company in the Bay Area. Have triathlete wife (Kona qualifier, AWA and Top 10 AG in USA), 4 busy kids in grade school & middle school. But still have time to train (can commit to 1-2 hours per day and longer on weekends). Will be running Boston in the spring (4th consecutive year) and plan to do 70.3 Santa Rosa and either 70.3 Santa Cruz or Superfrog in the fall.
Your Races
- Boston Marathon 2018
- Santa Rosa 70.3 on July 28
- Santa Cruz 70.3 on Sept 9
Season Outline
These are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another one). You can change your plans on the Training Plan page by clicking the Move / Change button. Learn more about each plan on the Training Plan Central Page.
- Last updated by Coach on 09/20/2017
- Complete the Trial Testing Week, save your Bike and Run Zones to the My Zones Page.
- On 9/18/2017 Follow the Template Trial Week to end on 9/24/2017
- On 9/25/2017 Load the -- Run Durability 1 (9 months out) -- 4 weeks to end on 10/22/2017
- On 10/23/2017 Load the -- Run Durability 2 (8 months out) -- 4 weeks to end on 11/19/2017
- On 11/20/2017 Load the -- Run Durability 3 (7 months out) -- 4 weeks to end on 12/17/2017
- On 12/25/2017 Load the Advanced Marathon [Balanced], 24 Weeks to end on 4/16/2018
- On 04/17/2018 Load the EN*Half to end on 7/29/2018
- On 07/30/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 8/12/2018
- On 08/13/2018 Load the -- EN*Half to end on 9/9/2018
- On 09/10/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 9/23/2018
- On 09/24/2018 Load the -- Run Durability 1 (9 months out) -- 4 weeks to end on 10/21/2018
Coach Notes
Thanks for reaching out with your survey and giving me a chance to help you out! Given your early focus on Boston, I recommend using our balanced marathon plan which includes room for cycling. I say this because of your predisposition to run injury. The that plan, which kicks off Christmas week(Xmas point), we'll be are under ability program. Needs a three one month installments that you will follow, building up some strength and resiliency while we are not pushing the run pace.
Given that strength training has not been proven to help you, I recommend checking out a pre-run warm-up as well as getting very good at rolling and stretching those calves. Especially the peroneal tendon. An it never hurts to stretch out the hips too as the root cause could be higher in your kinetic chain.
What you do talk, I will want to go over some of your nutrition planning as well to make sure we're making the most of that.
That Warm Up
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YdenOdoz-MI
Contact Points
These are all the key points in your first year where we must talk. You can schedule all calls with me for these times online here. Please remember to include your phone number.
- Welcome Call in Week One (set it up here)
- Coach Call in Week Two to talk about your season (set it up here)
- End of Trial Call -- We review your experience & Unlock Year One / Race Execution for you (set it up here)
- End of Season Call -- We review your year & Strategize for your “gap” and Year Two (to be announced)
For short or last minute questions, we recommend you use the Red Chat Icon on the main Members website.
We have also organized a complete chart of the best ways to contact us online here.
Your First Month on the Team
You have quite a few things to do when you start up. There are instructions on the top of the website, but you can review them under Resources / 0-- First 30 Days on EN. If you have any trouble, don’t hesitate to reach out via the chat icon on the main Members website here.
Your First Year Inside Endurance Nation
RACE EXECUTION and how we can help you get faster by being smarter on race day. There are no medals for great swims or getting to the top of a hill first — on race day only your finish time counts. There are many ways of being faster, and here are some of the resources we have to help you out.
- The Four Keys of Race Execution Video: The Coaches walk you through the macro level elements of a successful race.
- Distance Specific Guidance: Learn the fundamentals of racing Short Course and Long Course events, from each discipline to pacing zones, etc.
- Race Specific Pages: We have aggregated information on specific races from the internet, race reports and even our own coaching resources. You can find your race Master Racing Page section.
- The Race Forums: You can search for race reports or connect with your teammates. There are sections for 70.3, 140.6, and Marathons.
Your Goals
- Top ten at a 70.3
- Qualify for Boston AT Boston
- IM in 2019
~ Coach P
Comments
Jenn Edwards here. Coach P has asked a few of our Wicked Smart Members to cover the Coaches Thread while he is in Kona kicking butt and taking names.
Bummer on the soleus and good call on standing down. You're right on track to keep up the swim and bike fitness. We do have AquaBike plans that would be good to sub in for the next couple of weeks. I see you are quite an accomplished athlete and have a solid S/B/R background! When you take a look at the plans, consider where you are at in your bike fitness specifically as they do have some longer rides. I'm betting you'd slide right in to weeks 1&2 of the "2017 AquaBike, Intermediate, 12wks" plan. This would support good fitness while you chill on the foot. That being said, if you don't presently have a three hour ride on your calendar, cut those back to 90' tops and build to 120' in the second week. Be mindful, of course that the bike could still stress the soleus and your #1 goal is to get healthy!
Hope that helps and don't hesitate to reach back out should you need additional guidance. Looking forward to cheering on your successes as you join the EN Family.
Again, welcome!!!
You could do the Bike Focus plan for sure, but it's really interim right now...I've updated your schedule above to show you in the Bike Focus OutSeason® training plan starting 10/30 to replace the RDP progression.
You can ignore the stand alone runs, swimming instead on M/W/F...when you are ready to run, you can start with a few brick runs.
Weekends in the OS are flexible for you if you want to get out, but that's up to you!
Looking forward to our call!
~ Coach P
Ps - you can update your profile picture while you wait!!!
Ps - thanks For updating the profile picture...you look good in blue, but RED is faster. #justsayin
Really enjoyed our first call; I will set up follow up call in 2 weeks. Thanks for feedback on the GT2000. I couldn't remember the brand of my racing flats; found them - they are Saucony Mirage 5. They are much lighter than the GT2000; during track workouts I've been able to hit mile repeats 10-15 seconds faster with the Saucony's. I worry about them breaking down in longer training runs so haven't used them but for track workouts & racing (incl 2 marathons). They have also been my triathlon race shoe. I also recently ordered 2 different shoes to try out: Saucony Triumph ISO 2 and Asics Gel-Kayano 23. Would be interested in your thoughts as I think that shoe selection is key to getting back on the road to recovery. (?)
For my strength training, I do Dr. Jordan Metzl's IronStrength workout for runners once/week (usually on my Wednesday rest day). I use the DVD - I've used for past 2 years and know it by heart but still watch it anyway out of habit.
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=ironstrength+workout+for+runners&view=detail&mid=D969E33F48831EA17BC7D969E33F48831EA17BC7&FORM=VIRE
I've also recently begun the recommendations from "The Cool Impossible" - starting with slant board movement sequence. I found trying to hold calf raise for 1-2 minutes a real challenge and after doing for about 3 weeks feel stronger. (I can hold now for >1 minute; when I started couldn't do 30 seconds.)
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=9Ueq5g2V&id=9E2BECA4E9229DF998D8D85FBBFC05E48A803821&thid=OIP.9Ueq5g2VsrLZk2mlbK_RNgEsCp&q=the+cool+impossible+slant+board+movement+sequence&simid=608022329919146438&selectedindex=1&mode=overlay&first=1
I've had a good training week (Week 3 of Bike Focus - Intermediate). Tuesday I hit 225W/217W/213W for my 3x12' intervals. Thurday I hit 227W/226W/229W for my 3x10' intervals. And yesterday I hit 250W/251W for my 2x8' intervals (may have slipped into Zone 5???). My heart rate monitor doesn't seem to work consistently when I ride aero so hard to get HR numbers but seems like I'm right at 150 BPM which is Zone 4 for me. I feel stronger and see it in my numbers as last Saturday I hit 231W/237W for my 2x8' intervals.
I plan to do an EZ mile test run after the bike later today to see how the leg feels. Will try the stretching routine you recommend.
Thanks!
Ross
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/azkqbqkr7ott6zi/AAAAWxy5Ix7QGNq5femnr6WJa?dl=0
Let me know if you're able to access the files.
Swim Workouts - We don't usually emphasize the swim in the winter, just because we prefer you to spend time doing the work that is going to make you faster (bike and run); especially if you are a life-long swimmer who can just bang out sets.
In terms of getting back to running we have our Run Re-Entry protocol here. This is a great way to work back into running; conservative enough that it works. Hardest part is being patient with the progression!! You can overlay this onto any plan you want in place of those existing runs.
Now as for how to track your data, Strava is the best place to aggregate it. As it starts to add up (swim, bike and run, so put them all in there...even if it has to be manual at times) we can begin to make more informed decisions about next steps based off of how your fitness is evolving!
~ Coach P
- Your hip flexors are tight, so you can work on that (can see with lack of full extension in rear leg and "tipping" of hips forward / arched lower back).
- Your elbows don't move as much as your hands do...so let's get those elbows moving...easiest way is to keep forearm / hands moving forward and up, NOT across your body.
- Your stride is SLIGHTLY (like 2%) too long...just changing your cadence up by a few steps per min should do it.
- Let's also try to get a slight lean...rather than looking ahead into the distance, let's have you looking towards the ground approximately 20 to 25 feet in front of you.
Good luck!~ Coach P
PS here is that hip video for a warm up!
First of all, CONGRATULATIONS on your finish at Cabo; holy smokes, was tracking you all day - amazing, and especially after just a few weeks out of Kona. You are an inspiration! Don't know how you do it, but hope to learn how.
Ok, so I finished the 6-week Bike Focus intermediate. Pretty happy with the progress on the bike. VO2 Max went from 255W to 274W and FTP from 219W to 238W.
Looking for some advice on my plan for next few weeks; I'm following the Run Re-Entry protocol (this week am at 7' walk/7' run) and limiting to the prescribed 3 runs per week. You originally had me down for Run Durability (7 months out) starting this week (4 weeks ending 12/17). Not sure if I should do that still as next 4 weeks I'm still on Run Re-Entry? Any suggestions on program to maintain gains on the bike while still getting back on my feet?
Thinking I just need a solid 4-week plan and then will be able to start the marathon training as you originally prescribed:
That and the Run Re-entry protocol I'm following puts me at 3 runs per week and 2 quality bikes. I could drop in a swim (typically 2000-3000 yards) and an active recovery day (stretch/strength). So here's what this week could look like.
Week 2 of 4 Run Re-Entry Protocol:
Monday = Rest / Active Recovery
Tuesday = Run (5' walk / 8' run)
Wednesday = Swim and/or Strength
Thursday = Run (5' walk / 8' run)
Friday = Bike (2x (12' Z4 intervals w/ 4' Z1 recovery between))
Saturday = Run (5' walk / 8' run)
Sunday = Bike (10x (1' Z5 / 1' Z1)), remaining time @ Z3 (2-3 hours)
I could then repeat this in subsequent weeks, finish w/ the 4th week of Run Durability 3 and then slide into Advanced Marathon (Balanced) on 12/25 as originally planned. Thoughts?
About 100 days away from Boston; had a good recovery/rehab and have been hitting paces and was pretty happy with my numbers. Last week started to feel some pain in right soleus (this is opposite leg from injury I had for most of 2017). It was first symptom and has me rattled. Been seeing therapist and ART / chiro has been helping. A bit concerned on the plan mileage as the Adv Marathon has me jump from 20 miles to 32 miles between Week 11 & 12. That's too big for me and with nagging muscle soreness don't want to go over the edge.
I've been doing about 1-2 swims per week and 1-2 bikes per week for cross train. Been doing a lot more stretching and do 1 strength session so a lot of hours non-running. I've had prior success with the "Run Less Run Faster" book from Runner's World (Bill Pierce / Scott Murr / Ray Moss). They use a 3-run-a-week training program. With my current mileage (20 miles/week) I'm at a point where I can drop into their plan at 13 weeks out from Boston and gradually up my mileage (NMT 10% per week) and will intersect w/ their plan at 10 weeks out. Would like to commit to the EN plan but the weekly mileage is so up & down I'm worried will set me up for injury.
Not sure how accurate, but my Running VO2 Max per my Garmin is like 57. My VDOT was 53.2 when I did the test on 12/25 (6:05/mile 5K). So based on numbers it would suggest if I can stay injury free I should be on track to hit a 3:10 Boston which is my primary goal this season.
Thoughts?
-Ross
You need to pick the plan that you think will set you up for the most success. If you are truly that fragile right now, then a reduced run program makes total sense. So you understand on the EN plan, the idea is work one week, recovery the next. It's not some crazy "muscle confusion" program or something.
I am not against the RLRF approach...so why don't we line that up and keep you rolling. Remember, your fitness is there, it's how you body handles "the work" that matters most right now.
Can you remind me if you have run Boston before and if so, what that was like?
~ Coach P
Thanks for quick response. This will be (I hope) 4th Boston in a row. First 3 were 3:11, 3:13 & 3:29, respectively.
Update after run this morning - turns out I really AM that fragile. Been averaging about 20 miles per week last several weeks and had a really good 12 mile run on Sunday (averaged 7:45/mile) and did 3x1 mile repeats at 6:30/mile on Tuesday without any pain or problems. Today had a short-ish tempo run after 1 mile WU. I did about 15 minutes of stretching (including 7 hips) and had a solid warmup and was feeling good. Pace was increasing each mile from 7:30 to 7:00 to 6:50 (you can see it in my Strava account). Was feeling great and in last mile of the 4-mile tempo run (was averaging about 7:00/mile) felt a strong tug in my right leg (believe to be soleus) and stopped me cold. Walked the rest of the way home. Have had ice & compression on it most of the day. Will see ART therapist tonight and see what he thinks. Really frustrating as I've been doing a lot of strength & stretching and was happy with progress - gaining confidence and all that. Was feeling really good about fitness; there just must be something going on with my form that is messing me up. My wife saw a run gait analysis lady in Oakland; I will be signing up to have them have a look when I'm back to running. In meantime, back to the pool and therapy. Ouch.
Also, can you please unlock your strava training log so I can dive in there? Instructions are here:
http://members.endurancenation.us/Resources/Wiki/tabid/91/Default.aspx?topic=Strava+Central
This way I can see more than individual sessions, etc. Thanks!
Sending you good vibes,
~ Coach P
Ok, Strava unlocked. Thanks for the tip; I didn't realize I had that hidden. Also updated my name to add the EN tagline so hopefully easier to find me. Everything is already synced to Garmin so unless I go undercover (usually unintentional when I forget my watch on swim or my HR monitor on bike) everything will be posted.
ART session was good; he found the cause immediately. Gastrocnemius group in my right leg; have been feeling some soreness there over the past week or so - likely pushing the pace too aggressive. Not too much damage; soft tissue area with a lot of blood flow so I'm optimistic can come back. Not ready to give up on BQ in Boston but methinks need to temper my enthusiasm in training. (Been hitting some mid to low 6:00 intervals lately; probably too fast too soon.) My wife reminded me that she BQ'd last year while never running more than 10 miles and doing mostly intense bike workouts. (Show off!)
Interesting thing about this injury is that it's is OPPOSITE leg to where some injuries plagued me early last year. Definitely believe I have some balance or gait issues going on.
I have some KT in the affected area; rode bike this morning with little to no pain. Even did a very light jog around the neighborhood (0.25 mile) afterward. Muscle definitely reminding me it's there but not screaming at me to stop like yesterday morning.
"Supposed" to have 9 mile run on weekend at 8:00/mile ... may replace with 1-2 hour bike targeting similar HR to simulate what I would be if it were a run; can get in some long course swimming too. Thoughts?
Wanted to check in with you to report on training progress. 7 weeks out from Boston Marathon and followed your advice - have limited mileage to less than 30 per week and have not pushed pace harder than tempo (no track workouts thus far). I'm doing 3 runs per week: 3 x 1 mile hard efforts (typically hitting 6:30-6:45 pace but no faster), a tempo run (generally not more than 5-6 miles @ 7:05-7:10 pace) and then a weekend long run. I did 18 miles on 2/18 @ 7:35/mi pace and a 20-miler yesterday @ 7:39/mi pace. (All posted on Strava.) Also doing 1-2 swims per week (5,000-7,500 yards per week) and 2 bike sets - the ones in the Plan.
Still have 3 goals for Boston:
1. To finish.
2. To finish with BQ - 2:00.
3. To finish with a PR (under 3:11).
I compared my recent long runs with the ones I did in 2016 (when I ran 3:13) and I'm within 0:05/mile of those runs so feeling more confident than I was several weeks back. Also got a proper run analysis in Oakland, CA - Dr Jess Greaux at Innerspot. (Check them out at innersport.com.) She caught a flaw in my run - hip on one side dips considerably more than other. Have increased my cadence (was <171 spm, now 175+ spm) and working on some core exercises.
Prepping for tri season which starts in earnest after Boston. Downside to the run focus is have lost power on bike; want to get on those Zwift rides but can't get the app to work right. At least I'll look good on the bike - scored new hydration & other cool stuff using the EN promo code @ Profile Design. Nice!
That said, you are missing some of the depth of the running you've done in the past. Your (very nice!) 16-miler this weekend shows it...fast, building and steady...through 16. My guess is you'll have to make a few smart decisions on race day:
1 - Smart first few miles given the downhill "nature" of the course...aka, don't force them. Really use your higher cadence here.
2 - Good fueling early on (say miles 6 & 12) so you are ready for the second half suffering.
3 - Switch to caffeine in the hills and take baby steps up the hills, limiting damage (not running "hard" here), with an eye towards a great last 4 miles.
Don't let the numbers on the dial in the hills get you down, instead, focus on your HR and keep it in a good place. My guess is 160-165 is the upper end you can sit on and still run well for the end, but let me know what you are thinking!
~ Coach P
Feet up here in Boston 2 days out from Marathon Monday. Feeling pretty confident going into the race. Stats on last several long(ish) runs - all with hills, the 20 miler had Newton hill % grades included:
3/31: 13.1 miles @ 7:10 pace. HR avg = 158 bpm
3/24: 20.0 miles @ 7:07 pace. HR avg = 154 bpm
3/17: 15.0 miles @ 7:03 pace. HR avg = 157 bpm
Compare those numbers to last 3 Boston marathons:
2017: 3:29 (7:57 pace). HR avg = unknown (HR monitor fail) but disaster struck @ bottom of 1st Newton hill. Pace never recovered.
2016: 3:13 (7:20 pace). HR avg = 164 bpm
2015: 3:11 (7:14 pace). HR avg = 151 bpm
And I tried the caffeine at Mile 16 during my 20-miler and holy cow, had an immediate effect. Have never done that. Great call; looking forward to taking some as I turn the corner at the firehouse in Newton.
So, all in all, feeling good, feeling strong (no pain for last few months). Have to respect the race & the course ... and will take what weather Boston gives me. (Forecast for 50's, rain & decent headwind throughout; could make for an interesting day.)
Wish me luck! Not sure that there are too many EN folks racing. Did find one; going to try and meet up.
Santa Rosa 70.3 up next.
unfolded and what lessons learned you have!
https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/24692/ross-randolph-2018-boston-marathon-race-report#latest
Can you have a look at my training plan and timing? This is what you had given me:
- On 4/17/2018 Load the Advanced EN*Half to end on 05/20/2018
- On 5/21/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 6/3/2018
But my next races are:* Santa Rosa 70.3 on July 28
* Santa Cruz 70.3 on Sept 9
I think the Advanced EN*Half end date may be incorrect?
Also thinking about adding 2 races to calendar this year:
*Santa Rosa marathon to sneak in a BQ for 2019. Race is August 26.
*IM 70.3 Langkawi in Malaysia (Nov 17).
- On 04/17/2018 Load the EN*Half to end on 7/29/2018
- On 07/30/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 8/12/2018
- On 08/13/2018 Load the -- EN*Half to end on 9/9/2018
- On 09/10/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 9/23/2018
- On 09/24/2018 Load the -- Run Durability 1 (9 months out) -- 4 weeks to end on 10/21/2018
Note that we have flexibility between the half plans. I would likely recommend a bike push in the week of 8/6 (second week post Half) but we can decide later.In the meantime, how are you doing now?
~ Coach P
@Coach Patrick - thanks for the update. Things going well. Finished Boston (did you see my race report?); did not achieve my goals but chalk it up to the weather. Raced with the conditions I was given. Have been deep in the EN*Half training program, monitoring the forums and other resources. Enjoyed watching Team EN at IM Santa Rosa a few weekends ago; I met several at a dinner during the week. My wife raced and missed KQ by 1 slot (she placed 3rd in her AG, no rolldown). Looking forward to my 70.3 there as it's a course I know well.
Current fitness:
Bike FTP = 222W (May 1), compared to 226W (Nov 14), 208W (Sept 25) <-- still think this is my biggest opportunity
3-hour Power = 167 - 175W (based on last 4 weeks of ABP weekend rides)
Swim T-pace = 1:21 / 100yd
Run 5k = 19:32 (May 14)
Health-wise, everything seems to be working; have gotten over the niggle on my right leg from Boston and have been able to handle the intensity & volume of the EN*Half plan. Santa Rosa 70.3 race is 9 weeks out and would like to think I'm doing what's needed to yield Top 10 finish but not sure how realistic that is (I finished 21st last year). I believe my biggest opportunities are Bike & Nutrition. Plan to use forums to get some advice, especially on the Nutrition. Not sure I can do much more than what the plan says on the bike. (???)
I am confirmed for IM70.3 Malaysia in November, but will worry about that after the summer season.
I'm tempted to do Santa Rosa marathon (flat & fast) in August and BQ. However, don't want to jeopardize Santa Cruz 70.3 ... I'm still on the fence with that one. I'd ask your opinion but I think I already know what you'd say ...!
Another words, it’s pretty hard to improve your threshold power at this time of year but we can increase your bike strength and “mental acuity” here. If the full distance at Santa Rosa was any indication, your competition has no problem crushing the bike. We have to put you in a place where you could also get after it. Don’t think about it so much as doing 56 miles of pain, take a minute to look at the course and we can decide where A surge could be strategically more important.
For everyone else reading this, I know that this is not a typical recommendation! This is simply because of your swim fitness and running Pedegree.
To recap, don’t worry about the runs as your fitness is there. Frequency and some strides will be your friend. Just from his great and let’s keep that consistent as you continue to shed the run fatigue. The big Deltaville be emphasizing the bike in these next few weeks. If a longer Friday is not the best option for you, then maybe we work in to bigger bike weekends. Let me know what you think!