Thanks for the input. I like the suggestion and I’m in with the team. Timing is perfect for Fl70.3 Just wondering how to start the OS on OCT 4 and finish up training for the MCM on OCT 31.Should I go ahead and join early to get access to additional info in the wiki to help build this schedule or do you have a suggestion. From now until the marathon I am doing short 6-8 miles runs on Tuesday and Thursday with a longer 12-16 miles on Friday or Saturday, Biking on Monday and Wednesday. Also A race for 2011 will be South Carolina Half on Oct 1, 2011 so as planned will have 8 weeks between FL70.3 and build for SC half. Just curious as to what the plan for those 8 weeks would be. Restart OS or is there a hold training plan. Finally looking at the OS plan descriptions I think I would do the intermediate OS Plan (PR Sprint 1:18, PR Oly 3:07) is that a good start or would you recommended the beginner plan. Thanks again for all the info.
Ok, I think I am going to jump in. My main goals for next season is to get faster! I would like to be competitive in sprints and oly's, saving my IM for 2012, although I may do Syracuse 70.3 because it is close to home and I would like to RACE it next year, not just "event" it! . I have been doing tri's for 3 years now, always a BOP, and it's time to move up. I am looking forward to OS training, just not sure when to start. I did Syracuse 70.3 on the 19th and I am walk/running a marathon on Oct 3rd. My first tri would be in the beginning of June 2011. SO... when should I start? (I also have a few pounds that need to go away.) Thanks.
First some background. I don’t ease into anything and I don’t quit either. My first race ever was a marathon in 2004, and my first triathlon was Lobsterman in 2009. I had no background in running, biking, or swimming. Heck, before my first tri I had never swam a lap in a pool, let alone freestyle!
I started running in 2000 and was hard pressed to run a mile without needing a walk break. In 2004 at age 46, I ran the MDI marathon in 4:06 and knew I had to do that again. Since then I have run 2 or 3 marathons a year (14 in all) and completed the JFK50 in under 10 hours. This year I ran 2 marathons 3 weeks apart, the second was a BQ @ 3:31, good enough for a wave 1 start!
This year: 3/24 New Bedford Half – 1:45 PR 4/1 Great Bay Half – 1:44 PR 4/24 Louisville Marathon – 3:52 (bonk, temps near 80) 5/16 Sugarloaf Marathon – 3:31 BQ & PR 6/13 Pirate Tri – 1:34 8/1 Maine State Tri – 1:42 9/11 Pumpkinman Sprint – 1:27 PR 9/12 Pumpkinman Half Iron – 5:49 (first HIM) 10/17 MDI Marathon - can I BQ again?
Upcoming year: 3/20 New Bedford Half – tune up (C) 4/3 Great Bay Half – tune up (B) 4/17 Boston Marathon – NOT optional (A) 6/5 Mooseman 70.3 – tune up (B) 7/24 IMLP (A) 10/16 MDI (A) – 8th time running my “home” race
So, my questions involve OS start / end, IM prep start, and how best to work around Boston training. I was thinking I would start my OS 20 week plan in late October after MDI, and stay with it to early March. My Boston training will likely begin Christmas week which means it overlaps the OS plan by 12 weeks.
Is there any logical way to approach merging/overlapping these plans?
I don’t expect to podium in any races and I certainly don’t expect to qualify for Kona, so any finish at IM will be acceptable. Realistically, I am looking at sub 14 hour finish as an great first IM goal to shoot for.
Thanks for opening the haus up to the rest of us to get a better feel for what goes on inside. I just started multisport- coming from a mostly cycling background. I ran some races and a couple HM but I am no speedster. I did a sprint in June (my first race) and a HIM 2 weeks ago. I did the 12 week HIM intermediate plan and felt good with a 5:48 finish. My goal for next year is CdA and a HM on 3/14. If I start OS in November that ends on the HM and gives me 2 weeks before my IM plan starts. Is that the best way? Are there tweaks that you guys do to the plans if you are a member vs. the generic OS intermediate plan and 12 week IM plan? My other question is how to incorporate a bike commute 2-3 days a week (15 miles each way). I ride with a buddy who crushes me. It's usually zone 3-4 with a few zone 5 sprint points. Can this be worked in?
Please ask questions as bullets, easier for PnI to see and respond to.
You would fit the Intermediate profile but we can always bump you down if needed.
When you start is up to you and your budget.
Finally, my general advice, and hopefully others are listening: PnI have been working with athletes and training schedules for a long, long time. In our experience its just not worth thinking about, or planning too much/worry about the shoulda coulda woulda of stuff that's more than about 3-4mo in the future. So while it's fine to be curious about what you're doing in a two week training block 10mo into future, it's really not productive to discuss it much...cuz everything could change between now and then. So, the short answer, is that on the Team you've got the heads of two smart guys and 400+ other peeps to help you solve any problem you have in real time.
@Jo, based your marathon in October I would recommend either a NovOS start date or January. Please see the Member Hold post in this forum for instructions and more details.
Recommend NovOS start for you but we will likely need to work with you in the members Micro Thread to help you modify your first couple weeks of training.
Do the OS, recommend you do the "warm winter running volume option" (explained in the plans) beginning maybe mid Feb
Ping us early March in the Macro Thread to work out how to modify our OS plan to fit Boston.
Post Boston Patrick has some marathon recovery resources for you and he can work with you to figure out what your transition looks like from Boston to beginning to train for IMLP
DO NOT recommend you do Mooseman. We need you focused on Ironman training, given the Boston compromises that will have been made above.
Go to the blog and find a post I wrote a few weeks ago about how to stack our plans across a season. Read that and come back here if you have questions.
The OS plans are tough. Common theme over the years is that when people add extra cirricular stuff to the plan...it usually doesn't go very well. You may find yourself in a position to make a choice between training or commuting, or do our workouts during the commute but your guy on your schedule, not you on his, especially if he's not doing our run workouts when he's not riding his bike. Very powerful to ride and train with faster people so you should get creative to maintain that opportunity but on your terms.
I am planning on IM Canada on August 28, 2011. I live in Ontario so I won't be doing any racing until early June (with a small possibility of maybe going down to Triple T again at the end of May). That seems like a Nov. 1 OS start, doesn't it?
1. Recommend NovOS start for you but we will likely need to work with you in the members Micro Thread to help you modify your first couple weeks of training.
2. Do the OS, recommend you do the "warm winter running volume option" (explained in the plans) beginning maybe mid Feb
3. Ping us early March in the Macro Thread to work out how to modify our OS plan to fit Boston.
4. Post Boston Patrick has some marathon recovery resources for you and he can work with you to figure out what your transition looks like from Boston to beginning to train for IMLP
5. DO NOT recommend you do Mooseman. We need you focused on Ironman training, given the Boston compromises that will have been made above.
Thanks Rich,
Sounds like great way to start.
1. Nov 1 for OS should work fine
2. I always opt for outside when I can - deadmilling is mind-numbing!
3. I was thinking early Feb, but OK
4. useful info is alway welcome
5. this is a suprise but I get it. Races are fun but can be a distraction or the source of a major injury - I dont need that 7 weeks out from IMLP
I plan to lurk as a trial user for a little longer to decide if I should pull the triggerr or go dormant till November. Thnaks again.
A question on the plan(s) vs. joining the full team and the economics of it all.....
My A race is Challenge Copehagen on August 14th, 2011. Its my first irondistance race so I assume that I will need coaching and I would envision being part of the team once my training starts. I also want to do the outseason but I'm not sure if I need to be part of the team to do the outseason work effectively.
Background, I just finished a half marathon on Sunday - slower then I wanted. In my head I was thinking of starting the outseason Oct and than the full IM training plan come January. I was going to swim in the fall but after reading the info here and recognizing that I need to get faster on the bike and run I put off swimming unitl January.
What is the most cost effective training plan for me?
ie. if I but the outseason plan now I save 10% but come January I need to buy the team membership for $130/month but if I joined the team now it would be at $99/month - so using my math it seems as though the cheapest option would be to join the team now for 99$/month? I hope this didn't come accross as too confusing.
Bottom line is that funds are limited and I'm looking to save money but train properly Thanks, Erika
I think it would be a great idea for me to join EN. I just don't know when to do it? Right now I am tapering and will do Myrtle Beach HIM. I am obviously not following the schedule you sent. Then I will do Clearwater. Should I join right now or freeze untill a later date? Would you help me transition from MB to Clearwater? Then I have Vegas half marathon on Dec. 5th. Then OS will start.
@Erika - The best bet is to join at $99 and lock it in. We get cheaper each year (y2 for you will be $79/mo, etc) so things only get better. Given you just raced and your A event isn't until Aug, unless you have an early season half that's important for you I'd sign up now but then send in an email to hold@endurancenation.us to delay your first month until a November 1 OS start. You'll have to chill / have fun / be active on your own for Oct…but you'll be ready come the OS for sure!!!
@Jane -- Hey, you are busy!!! Joining is totally fine, and we can help you transition, etc,. post MB for sure, then the half and beyond…it's what we do. Don't let all this OS talk make you think it's the only option…we love helping you RACE!
Thanks RnP for your responses to my questions so far - the feedback has been great.
A couple more, if you don't mind:
1. Does a past injury factor into how long you should make your training season? This past season I ended up with a stress fracture in my ankle (yes, I'm going to have someone look into this...) and I'm wondering whether a long training season would be best (as it would provide more time to adapt) or whether I should shorten my training season this year to reduce the overall start-to-finish training volume. I'm pretty much 100% at this point, btw.
2. How does a 2-week vacation factor into the OS? I've got one planned for mid-February so if I start the OS in Oct I can pretty much be done by then (week 19) and make this vacation my transition, but if I start in Nov the vacation lands right around the 2/3 mark of the OS. In the Nov scenario, would I just do some light running on vacation and then pick up the OS where I left off when I return?
Because my "A" race isn't until the end of August (IMC) and we have the potential for snow until at least May, I've got a long season ahead of me with little opportunity for an early HIM (see snow comment above..). I'm itching to get going since it has been 2 months since my "A" race and 1 month since my last tri (Oly) but at the same time I don't want to risk starting too early and burning out in June. I know I've told you what I would ideally like to do (Oct start), but I would appreciate knowing what you would recommend in this scenario and whether you think:
1. interrupting the OS for 2 weeks is a big deal; 2. I'm risking injury by starting in October.
I have been thinking about my schedule for 2011, and also thinking if it is time to race a full IM. I know there are different approaches to this, and have read some recent threads about doing an IM too soon. I am also cautious of the incremental time required to train for an IM over a half.
Maybe I should concentrate on the shorter stuff; race two half’s and plan on an IM for 2012, which seems so far away. I know I could “finish” an IM in 2011, but I want to be able to “race”.
My target IM (for me Lake Placid) is sold out for 2011, or requires a foundation slot ($1,150). I am not opposed to a non-IM brand full distance race. I did like the big field and “pro” feel of Timberman. I would not want to do a 150 person full. If I sign up for IM Florida or Arizona in Nov 2011, I am worried about motivation to train in Sep and Oct, with kids busy and in school, daylight waning, hard to get in morning and evening rides and runs, etc. I have my last sprint of the season on Sunday, and I have had a hard time getting in the training. The July- August time frame is perfect for me. That’s one reason Lake Placid would be perfect, also because of location.
If I delay IM until 2012, I would race two half’s in 2011; either Mooseman, Patriot (MA), Tinman or Musselman and then Timberman, Pumkinman(ME) or Galway, Ireland. Fill in the season with some fun sprints and Olys.
Some history and stats:
Swam in high school, rode bikes during college for fun; took 20 years off and got fat ~270.
2006-7 Lost weight; started riding again for fun and fitness, metric centuries, etc. ~ 200 lbs.
2008 started racing triathlons, 5 sprints ~200-205 lbs
2009 four sprints and one Olympic ~195lbs
2010 lost some more weight now at 175-185, Sprint, Olympic and half (Timberman)
45 years old, married, two kids, career, live in RI. 2010 results:
Sprint 9:16/30:20/23:04 pace 26:29/mile swim, 22.55 mph bike, 7:12/mile run 2/16 AG, 21/257 OA
Oly 25:26/1:15:21/55:28 pace 28:16/mile swim, 19.43mph bike, 8:57/mile run 5/25 AG, 62/317 OA
Half 33:00/2:54:07/2:08:52 27:30/mile swim, 19.30mph bike, 9:50/mile run 102/208 AG, 948/2142 OA
I do not have a long history in triathlons, or even riding or running. Swim is my relative strength (usually top 10%), bike is okay (top 20-30%) and run is the weakness (MOP or worse).
I really like the EN philosophy and plan. I have cancelled my idea of running a spring marathon, plan on an out season (20 weeks) of fast riding and running followed by a race prep of 12-16 weeks.
After a week or so of lurking, (Ok I have drank the Koolade and enjoyed it) I am still on the fence between self implementation of an EN OS plan or becoming a full fledged "Forum busting" member mainly due to budget constraints. Below is my tenative schedule for 2011 mainly due to clearance issues from the flight deck due to a currently low level of SAU's:
Oct OS Start
Jan 17 - Ice Breaker Half Marathon (just a run with the tri-team, no OS Effect)
May 15 - Rev 3 Oly / Half (Knoxville) (tenative, very tenative)
July 17 - Ironman Racine 70.3 (A race)
Sept ? - Rev 3 (Cedar Point) (70.3 or full depending on SAU's in bank at time, making deposits for full)
Maybe a local Oly or 2 thown in just for good measure as the racing schedule evolves
So, I guess I am asking for the "salesman" to come and sell me on the full membership benefits that I will get outside of the training plan for the extra $$$. (Hoping the sales pitch is heard by more people that are also asking the same question)
I have a PT, have been training with power, Normalized Power, Vdot, etc. But am also looking for a big improvment on my run splits hopefully by next season ( I am currently a FOP Swimmer, F/MOP biker, B/MOP runner ).
PnR - based on all that I have read, I need your opinion on how to proceed. Specifically:
1. I want to start the OS in Nov. So, the hold is what I plan to do
2. I typically plan my race season in Dec and take into account, work, family,and budget. No IM in 2011. So, I won't be able to submit my races or really plan my season as I begin the OS. Is that a problem?
I'm still on the fence between buying an out of season plan and a 12 week ironman plan or becoming a full member and I greatly appreciate this opportunity to check out a good part of what EN has to offer. So far I've put together this as my tentative plan for next season.
November 15-April 3rd: 20 week Out of Season Period
April 4th-April 17th: 2 week transition ending with "Big Ride Weekend" w/ 5+ hrs on Sat/Sun
April 18th- June 19th: 9 week Build Period ending with "Big Bike Week"
June 20th-Sept 11: 12 Week Ironman Plan ending with Ironman Wisconsin
The #1 race of the year is the Ironman. Other likely races are a 1/2 marathon in March, a half ironman in July, and an Olympic Distance event in early August.
So, my question is how does this plan work? Would you recommend any additions/subtractions/changes?
I'm wondering if EN would be a good fit for my race goals - my main focus will be xterra races next year, with some road tris (oly and sprint) thrown in for fun. I love the system and framework of EN, but wonder if it's a fit for the off-road tris. Thanks.
I have a few questions regarding my situation. I am a 22 year old, fresh out of college, and just started a job working ~80 hours a week. I the NYC Olympic in July (my first tri) and finished third in my AG (2:19:xx) and qualified for the national AG championships in Dallas in Oct (not going because of work). My goal is to finish first in my AG next year, hopefully coming in <2:15, and then progress to HIM and IM over the next few years. When I stumbled upon EN, it seemed like a great fit for me because of the emphasis on top end speed (most important for me since my focus will be an olympic) through shorter, intense workouts (better fits my work schedule) and deemphasis on swimming in the OS (difficulty of finding a consistent swimming routine in NYC). <br /> I have been following the program this week and came out with testing results of 174 BLTHR and VDOT of 53.7. My questions are:
-If I am doing an olympic, should I use a HIM plan and just trim down the volume on weekend workouts when I get to the build phase? -When should I start my OS if my A race is on Aug 7? I would like to start earlier than Jan. and will probably do the NYC half marathon in March to keep as an in-between goal? -Are there any other olympic people on here? When I first started this free trial I was just going to buy the training plans separate rather than becoming a full member. However, as I've experienced the benefits of the coaches and community, I am leaning toward becoming a full member. Just wondering if there are any other short distance people here that I could share experiences with and learn from.
Any other members (if they have the patience to read this) can send me a message if they have any insights/comments on my situation. Thanks everyone!
@Tyler - Your situation is unique in that your A race was a while ago, you have no HIM and your next A race is in Aug '11. I suggest you go Oct OS, exiting on vacation and really taking down time. When you come back, we can assess how to have you continue to improve without putting a full training block on you…perhaps a run focus or bike focus. But we'll want a break before you start full RacePrep stuff for IMC!
@John - Thanks for the info…if you live in RI we should talk!!! I say go halves again in 2011. You can do lots of great training without the pressure and really be ready to crush placid in 12. You have room to grow on the bike and the run and a good year will do that for you. Once you drop an IM on the plate, it takes up a lot of mental/physical space…and that could hurt the good thing you have going right now!
@Dave - I think you might get more "is EN Plan vs Team better" feedback in a regular thread you start…this is more for the coaches. I think that your plan looks good…the benefits of the Team is motivation through the OS, tons of learning and support in season, training rallys/other meet ups, etc. Using a plan alone is great. But being on the team makes just using a plan seem kinda old school. Feel free to try the team for a month in the OS just to see what it's like…
@Joe -- Not a problem at all! A refreshing change from the dodo who just asked me what I am doing in June 2012.
@Brent -- Great plan for non-Team. If you were on the Team, I'd have you train all out for you HIM, then move to a shortened IM plan to Wisco. 21 weeks to wisco is just a lot to swallow (from my experience)…it can be done, but we'd have you do something else to keep the progress rolling.
@Sumner - Great question. You are more than welcome to be here and use the plans and do your thing…it might not be as directly connected to your Xterra training than if you were training for a HIM, but we'll be here and we love to do cool stuff too. Who knows, you might convert a few others!
@Ian -- Congrats on that great finish in your first. Awesome. We generally reccommend that folks use the OS plan with the swim hack for OLY training. So in your case, do the full OS, with a NOV start. Then transition out via your half mary, take a bit of down time. Then when you are ready you can use the first 8 or last 6 weeks of the OS to get ready for the OLY, with the swim stuff. We can give you more detail as the season goes on…hope that helps!
Coach P - thanks for the response. The thing is, I haven't found anywhere that's a perfect fit for someone wanting to do xterra. Since I like everything I've seen of EN I think I'll join and use your plans to piece together an xterra season, since you seem up for helping me do that. Figuring that most xterras seems to come out somewhere around Olympic races or a bit harder effort-wise, and you've got some fixes using the OS plan for people racing Olys, I'm guessing it wouldn't be too hard for me to figure something out.
One last question - what are your thoughts on sprinkling some endurance MTB events (in the 6 hour range) into the OS? Is that totally crazy? (And not to worry, I do actually own and ride a road bike also, I just have a bit of a MTB fixation going right now.) Thanks.
Enjoying the site so far. background: 31 yr old male, married but no children, i have a Mon- Fri office job, but have a flexible training schedule (can workout in mornings and/or at lunch on workdays).
I will be entering my 2nd year of triathlon (3rd of endurance sports). I did 2 sprints this year and loved them.
currently, I design my own plan, based largely on my reading (and re-re-re) reading Friel's Bible. I also consult other web resources. I use a garmin 305 to record my HR and bike/run data,
to increase my running capacity (and to have a good time!), I am currently training for my first half marathon this Oct 17th, after that I will enter outseason.
Next year training plan: I plan on my first peak/"A Race" of the season in mid-May or June with my first Olympic (Black Bear Tri on 6/5 is possibility). Then, I would do another peak in the fall, closing my season with my final A race, my first 70.3. For now, the inaugural Pocono Mountain 70.3 on 10/2 looks fun (I am in Princeton, NJ, so its close).
How would something like this work: begin 20 week OS on 12/1. after that take two weeks to recover (I see that suggested somewhere), then have 20 weeks to train for the inaugural Pocono Mtn 70.3, with Oly or Sprint races in every few weeks from week 4 to 16? (NYC Oly, NJ Tri, Philly, Black Bear, and other regional races). or would starting OS on 11/1 and then doing some sort of 8-10 wk program for an Oly I mark as an A race, followed by another 12 week program to close with the Pocano 70.3 be better?
next year I would like to begin training with power. I also need a road/tri bike. I posted in another trial member thread discussing bike v power trainer about this as well. I am more than willing to put the time in trying my best to learn how to race with power, want to make sure I buy the best gear for my budget. I love doing research, but will likely have tons of questions
We are doing IMCdA next year and it looks like Oct. OS is the best option. We have a marathon scheduled Oct. 17. Could we start the OS on Nov. 1st. If you count the weeks we should be able to get a full OS in then take a couple weeks off then start a 12 week IM plan. What are your thoughts?
I have been very impressed with your philosophy and I am thinking hard about joining the team. I am doing IM FL 2010 and for 2011 tentatively planning:
70.3 Buffalo Springs
70.3 Austin
When would I start the OS Plan and how would that be integrated into the HIM Plan in preparation for Buffalo Springs? Do you suggest completing all 20 weeks of the OS Plan, first? For example, if I started the OS Plan Jan 4, race day would be 26 weeks away. I also travel a lot for work, but understand we can see the prescribed training sessions for the weeks ahead so modifications can be made accordingly.
RnP— I’ve been trying to figure out when to start, and what to start with. Here is my story: running my first marathon Jan 16th (signed up and committed to this before I knew EN’s feelings on an OS marathon). During this time I will also be leading 3 CT group rides at my local performance center, instructing 2 TRX classes, swimming 2x per week, and hopefully also getting in a weekly yoga session or two. I am planning on Honu which is June 4th (my first HIM). There are 20 weeks between the marathon and Honu….so what do I do with those 20 weeks?? Take a couple weeks off and then begin the 12 week 70.3 plan?? Thoughts??? Thanks Dana
@Sumner -- Will be great to have you here! As for the MTB events, you can do them if you aren't also doing 2 x 3hr MTB rides during the week to prep for them. That would basically supplant the entire bike portion of the OS plans! We can hack it out in the Macro thread when you are ready…
@Michael - Love the questions…keep's coming! I prefer you start OS in OCT, then do an 8 weak-ish build to your OLY. then break and do the HIM plan. There will be some work around making the OLY plan (they are in our hopper) but we'll hook you up for sure. I really like you doing a full proper HIM build to the poconos. And yes to any all races @ end of OS and building to your OLY. Once we hit HIM time we need to be cautious!
@Kelly, given your fall race, yes to the Nov start for sure. Full post marathon recovery please!!! We can massage the schedule to make it work for CDA, but step #1 is emerging from the marathon well rested and healthy!!!
@Mike, I would go with a fun/light fall for now. Maybe a fall century or fun run or run focus. Then start the OS on 1/3. OS ends 5/22, two weeks off ends 6/5. Then 6 weeks to HIM. One week break, then IM training through Cedar Point. The 25 can be part of your OS! Let me know how else we can help!
@Jason, you could start in Dec with the OS after IMFL, giving you a bit more time to get more miles on your legs pre buffalo springs. Dec is a tough motivational time, however, so that would be a Team Member decision methinks. Otherwise a Jan start is fine, we can make that work too!
@Dana -- Holy definition of busy! I say you take 2 weeks of post marathon to recover (if that's possible given your schedule). Then do the first 8 weeks of the OS into 8-10 weeks of HIM training. We want you to get some OS benefits!!!
Some random questions while trying to decide on team vs. training plan purchase ....
First, some background. 47 yr old former college swimmer/high school runner been running tri's on and off (mostly off) since 1983. Started to get back in shape about 3 years ago, took it very slowly, first 5 mile running event in about 6 years in summer of 2008. Got a little more serious in begining of 2009, lost some weight, ran HM in May and then entered and finished Steelhead 70.3. Continued on training plan, lost some more weight, ran same HM in 2010 ( 14 min faster) and Steelhead again (35 min improvement). Have always believed in the "higher intensity-less duration" method for swimming and biking, and do a bit of shorter faster runs but mostly just running more, not fast. I've always been self-coached, but I do have a pretty good network of smart folks/coaches that are good at one (swim/bike/run) that I can draw from for single sport ideas and input. I don't have a grand plan in place for 2011, but kicking around a late summer IM -- possibly IM Louisville or Rev 3. Maybe a June/July HM as a test run, and a couple of WTF local events that friends convince me to enter.
Questions: this is what happens when you lurk for a week or so ...
1. How have people who have had some running injury issues handled the intensity of the OS. I've been typically doing some interval training one day/wk and can handle that, but not sure how the body would hold up to more.
2. In the 3 week trial workouts, I see a number of short bricks. Execution of these might be a struggle with current workout limitations, is there any workable substitute, or is the brick critical to the adaptation you're looking for ?
3. What do people who have a long ramp up time for swimming do ? Its taken a long time in the past for me to find some swim form, and I'd hate to give up the one part of the event where I actually feel competent.
4. With a 11/6/10 HM on the schedule and 2011 pretty fluid right now, what OS would you suggest ?
5. Should trial members be able to get in the data tool, and if so, where should I look for some easy to use instructions. I've tried to sign in under the training/data tool tab, but I get "login failed". I did do the 5k run test, and was curious about what the calc might be.
6. I do alot of my OS (former off-season) run training inside on treadmill. Should I test both outside and on treadmill for run, or is there an easy way to adjust from one to the other in your plans ?
Thanks to both of you for the opportunity to take the site for a test drive, and congratulations on your successes. Looking forward to your feedback on the questions, and getting off the fence on the full membership or training plan.
Thanks for the feedback Pat. I like the idea of full OS to a 8ish week build to an Oly, then a proper HIM plan leading to Poconos.
I see the loaded OS start for me is oct 4, which is in line with what you had suggested in your post. Note that I have my first half marathon on 10/17 (end of week 2 of OS). I read the wiki on doing a half marathon in the OS, and it was very helpful in having me try to structure the first 3 weeks of my OS.
I really look forward to participating in the OS plan!!
Comments
Coach P,
Thanks for the input. I like the suggestion and I’m in with the team. Timing is perfect for Fl70.3 Just wondering how to start the OS on OCT 4 and finish up training for the MCM on OCT 31.Should I go ahead and join early to get access to additional info in the wiki to help build this schedule or do you have a suggestion. From now until the marathon I am doing short 6-8 miles runs on Tuesday and Thursday with a longer 12-16 miles on Friday or Saturday, Biking on Monday and Wednesday. Also A race for 2011 will be South Carolina Half on Oct 1, 2011 so as planned will have 8 weeks between FL70.3 and build for SC half. Just curious as to what the plan for those 8 weeks would be. Restart OS or is there a hold training plan. Finally looking at the OS plan descriptions I think I would do the intermediate OS Plan (PR Sprint 1:18, PR Oly 3:07) is that a good start or would you recommended the beginner plan. Thanks again for all the info.
I started running in 2000 and was hard pressed to run a mile without needing a walk break. In 2004 at age 46, I ran the MDI marathon in 4:06 and knew I had to do that again. Since then I have run 2 or 3 marathons a year (14 in all) and completed the JFK50 in under 10 hours. This year I ran 2 marathons 3 weeks apart, the second was a BQ @ 3:31, good enough for a wave 1 start!
This year:
3/24 New Bedford Half – 1:45 PR
4/1 Great Bay Half – 1:44 PR
4/24 Louisville Marathon – 3:52 (bonk, temps near 80)
5/16 Sugarloaf Marathon – 3:31 BQ & PR
6/13 Pirate Tri – 1:34
8/1 Maine State Tri – 1:42
9/11 Pumpkinman Sprint – 1:27 PR
9/12 Pumpkinman Half Iron – 5:49 (first HIM)
10/17 MDI Marathon - can I BQ again?
Upcoming year:
3/20 New Bedford Half – tune up (C)
4/3 Great Bay Half – tune up (B)
4/17 Boston Marathon – NOT optional (A)
6/5 Mooseman 70.3 – tune up (B)
7/24 IMLP (A)
10/16 MDI (A) – 8th time running my “home” race
So, my questions involve OS start / end, IM prep start, and how best to work around Boston training. I was thinking I would start my OS 20 week plan in late October after MDI, and stay with it to early March. My Boston training will likely begin Christmas week which means it overlaps the OS plan by 12 weeks.
Is there any logical way to approach merging/overlapping these plans?
I don’t expect to podium in any races and I certainly don’t expect to qualify for Kona, so any finish at IM will be acceptable. Realistically, I am looking at sub 14 hour finish as an great first IM goal to shoot for.
Any insight will be greatly appreciated.
Run Strong
Steven
Thanks for opening the haus up to the rest of us to get a better feel for what goes on inside. I just started multisport- coming from a mostly cycling background. I ran some races and a couple HM but I am no speedster. I did a sprint in June (my first race) and a HIM 2 weeks ago. I did the 12 week HIM intermediate plan and felt good with a 5:48 finish.
My goal for next year is CdA and a HM on 3/14. If I start OS in November that ends on the HM and gives me 2 weeks before my IM plan starts. Is that the best way? Are there tweaks that you guys do to the plans if you are a member vs. the generic OS intermediate plan and 12 week IM plan?
My other question is how to incorporate a bike commute 2-3 days a week (15 miles each way). I ride with a buddy who crushes me. It's usually zone 3-4 with a few zone 5 sprint points. Can this be worked in?
Thanks for the advice.
Dave
Maybe I'm posting this in the right place...
Goals for next year...at this point, kinda up in the air.
But, I do know this..
Crush all my training partners all year long.
Hammer up Brasstown Bald, http://www.brasstownbaldbustercentury.com/ in the spring.
Chattanooga's Oly in July.
Six Gap Century in late September.
one 'A' race, full IM in Fall. Hawaii (lottery, if lucky), Silverman, or B2B.
So, when do I start the OS? And how do I piggyback a plan on to the end of the OS?
Am I going to have to put the peanut M&M's down?
thx,
C
@Matt, maybe/maybe not but we have time to address that when it comes.
@Dewey:
Finally, my general advice, and hopefully others are listening: PnI have been working with athletes and training schedules for a long, long time. In our experience its just not worth thinking about, or planning too much/worry about the shoulda coulda woulda of stuff that's more than about 3-4mo in the future. So while it's fine to be curious about what you're doing in a two week training block 10mo into future, it's really not productive to discuss it much...cuz everything could change between now and then. So, the short answer, is that on the Team you've got the heads of two smart guys and 400+ other peeps to help you solve any problem you have in real time.
@Jo, based your marathon in October I would recommend either a NovOS start date or January. Please see the Member Hold post in this forum for instructions and more details.
@Steven:
@David:
@Chris:
I am planning on IM Canada on August 28, 2011. I live in Ontario so I won't be doing any racing until early June (with a small possibility of maybe going down to Triple T again at the end of May). That seems like a Nov. 1 OS start, doesn't it?
Thanks for your help with this!
---Ann.
Thanks Rich,
Sounds like great way to start.
1. Nov 1 for OS should work fine
2. I always opt for outside when I can - deadmilling is mind-numbing!
3. I was thinking early Feb, but OK
4. useful info is alway welcome
5. this is a suprise but I get it. Races are fun but can be a distraction or the source of a major injury - I dont need that 7 weeks out from IMLP
I plan to lurk as a trial user for a little longer to decide if I should pull the triggerr or go dormant till November. Thnaks again.
Run Strong,
Steven
Ann, yes, that's a Nov 1 start for sure! Enjoy your october!!!
Patrick
My A race is Challenge Copehagen on August 14th, 2011. Its my first irondistance race so I assume that I will need coaching and I would envision being part of the team once my training starts. I also want to do the outseason but I'm not sure if I need to be part of the team to do the outseason work effectively.
Background, I just finished a half marathon on Sunday - slower then I wanted. In my head I was thinking of starting the outseason Oct and than the full IM training plan come January. I was going to swim in the fall but after reading the info here and recognizing that I need to get faster on the bike and run I put off swimming unitl January.
What is the most cost effective training plan for me?
ie. if I but the outseason plan now I save 10% but come January I need to buy the team membership for $130/month but if I joined the team now it would be at $99/month - so using my math it seems as though the cheapest option would be to join the team now for 99$/month? I hope this didn't come accross as too confusing.
Bottom line is that funds are limited and I'm looking to save money but train properly
Thanks,
Erika
@Jane -- Hey, you are busy!!! Joining is totally fine, and we can help you transition, etc,. post MB for sure, then the half and beyond…it's what we do. Don't let all this OS talk make you think it's the only option…we love helping you RACE!
A couple more, if you don't mind:
1. Does a past injury factor into how long you should make your training season? This past season I ended up with a stress fracture in my ankle (yes, I'm going to have someone look into this...) and I'm wondering whether a long training season would be best (as it would provide more time to adapt) or whether I should shorten my training season this year to reduce the overall start-to-finish training volume. I'm pretty much 100% at this point, btw.
2. How does a 2-week vacation factor into the OS? I've got one planned for mid-February so if I start the OS in Oct I can pretty much be done by then (week 19) and make this vacation my transition, but if I start in Nov the vacation lands right around the 2/3 mark of the OS. In the Nov scenario, would I just do some light running on vacation and then pick up the OS where I left off when I return?
Because my "A" race isn't until the end of August (IMC) and we have the potential for snow until at least May, I've got a long season ahead of me with little opportunity for an early HIM (see snow comment above..). I'm itching to get going since it has been 2 months since my "A" race and 1 month since my last tri (Oly) but at the same time I don't want to risk starting too early and burning out in June. I know I've told you what I would ideally like to do (Oct start), but I would appreciate knowing what you would recommend in this scenario and whether you think:
1. interrupting the OS for 2 weeks is a big deal;
2. I'm risking injury by starting in October.
Thanks.
Tyler
After a week or so of lurking, (Ok I have drank the Koolade and enjoyed it) I am still on the fence between self implementation of an EN OS plan or becoming a full fledged "Forum busting" member mainly due to budget constraints. Below is my tenative schedule for 2011 mainly due to clearance issues from the flight deck due to a currently low level of SAU's:
So, I guess I am asking for the "salesman" to come and sell me on the full membership benefits that I will get outside of the training plan for the extra $$$. (Hoping the sales pitch is heard by more people that are also asking the same question)
I have a PT, have been training with power, Normalized Power, Vdot, etc. But am also looking for a big improvment on my run splits hopefully by next season ( I am currently a FOP Swimmer, F/MOP biker, B/MOP runner ).
PnR - based on all that I have read, I need your opinion on how to proceed. Specifically:
1. I want to start the OS in Nov. So, the hold is what I plan to do
2. I typically plan my race season in Dec and take into account, work, family,and budget. No IM in 2011. So, I won't be able to submit my races or really plan my season as I begin the OS. Is that a problem?
Joe
I'm still on the fence between buying an out of season plan and a 12 week ironman plan or becoming a full member and I greatly appreciate this opportunity to check out a good part of what EN has to offer. So far I've put together this as my tentative plan for next season.
November 15-April 3rd: 20 week Out of Season Period
April 4th-April 17th: 2 week transition ending with "Big Ride Weekend" w/ 5+ hrs on Sat/Sun
April 18th- June 19th: 9 week Build Period ending with "Big Bike Week"
June 20th-Sept 11: 12 Week Ironman Plan ending with Ironman Wisconsin
The #1 race of the year is the Ironman. Other likely races are a 1/2 marathon in March, a half ironman in July, and an Olympic Distance event in early August.
So, my question is how does this plan work? Would you recommend any additions/subtractions/changes?
Thanks for help.
Thanks.
I have a few questions regarding my situation. I am a 22 year old, fresh out of college, and just started a job working ~80 hours a week. I the NYC Olympic in July (my first tri) and finished third in my AG (2:19:xx) and qualified for the national AG championships in Dallas in Oct (not going because of work). My goal is to finish first in my AG next year, hopefully coming in <2:15, and then progress to HIM and IM over the next few years. When I stumbled upon EN, it seemed like a great fit for me because of the emphasis on top end speed (most important for me since my focus will be an olympic) through shorter, intense workouts (better fits my work schedule) and deemphasis on swimming in the OS (difficulty of finding a consistent swimming routine in NYC). <br />
I have been following the program this week and came out with testing results of 174 BLTHR and VDOT of 53.7. My questions are:
-If I am doing an olympic, should I use a HIM plan and just trim down the volume on weekend workouts when I get to the build phase?
-When should I start my OS if my A race is on Aug 7? I would like to start earlier than Jan. and will probably do the NYC half marathon in March to keep as an in-between goal?
-Are there any other olympic people on here? When I first started this free trial I was just going to buy the training plans separate rather than becoming a full member. However, as I've experienced the benefits of the coaches and community, I am leaning toward becoming a full member. Just wondering if there are any other short distance people here that I could share experiences with and learn from.
Any other members (if they have the patience to read this) can send me a message if they have any insights/comments on my situation. Thanks everyone!
@John - Thanks for the info…if you live in RI we should talk!!! I say go halves again in 2011. You can do lots of great training without the pressure and really be ready to crush placid in 12. You have room to grow on the bike and the run and a good year will do that for you. Once you drop an IM on the plate, it takes up a lot of mental/physical space…and that could hurt the good thing you have going right now!
@Dave - I think you might get more "is EN Plan vs Team better" feedback in a regular thread you start…this is more for the coaches. I think that your plan looks good…the benefits of the Team is motivation through the OS, tons of learning and support in season, training rallys/other meet ups, etc. Using a plan alone is great. But being on the team makes just using a plan seem kinda old school. Feel free to try the team for a month in the OS just to see what it's like…
@Joe -- Not a problem at all! A refreshing change from the dodo who just asked me what I am doing in June 2012.
@Brent -- Great plan for non-Team. If you were on the Team, I'd have you train all out for you HIM, then move to a shortened IM plan to Wisco. 21 weeks to wisco is just a lot to swallow (from my experience)…it can be done, but we'd have you do something else to keep the progress rolling.
@Sumner - Great question. You are more than welcome to be here and use the plans and do your thing…it might not be as directly connected to your Xterra training than if you were training for a HIM, but we'll be here and we love to do cool stuff too. Who knows, you might convert a few others!
@Ian -- Congrats on that great finish in your first. Awesome. We generally reccommend that folks use the OS plan with the swim hack for OLY training. So in your case, do the full OS, with a NOV start. Then transition out via your half mary, take a bit of down time. Then when you are ready you can use the first 8 or last 6 weeks of the OS to get ready for the OLY, with the swim stuff. We can give you more detail as the season goes on…hope that helps!
One last question - what are your thoughts on sprinkling some endurance MTB events (in the 6 hour range) into the OS? Is that totally crazy?
Thanks.
Hi,
Enjoying the site so far. background: 31 yr old male, married but no children, i have a Mon- Fri office job, but have a flexible training schedule (can workout in mornings and/or at lunch on workdays).
I will be entering my 2nd year of triathlon (3rd of endurance sports). I did 2 sprints this year and loved them.
currently, I design my own plan, based largely on my reading (and re-re-re) reading Friel's Bible. I also consult other web resources. I use a garmin 305 to record my HR and bike/run data,
to increase my running capacity (and to have a good time!), I am currently training for my first half marathon this Oct 17th, after that I will enter outseason.
Next year training plan: I plan on my first peak/"A Race" of the season in mid-May or June with my first Olympic (Black Bear Tri on 6/5 is possibility). Then, I would do another peak in the fall, closing my season with my final A race, my first 70.3. For now, the inaugural Pocono Mountain 70.3 on 10/2 looks fun (I am in Princeton, NJ, so its close).
How would something like this work: begin 20 week OS on 12/1. after that take two weeks to recover (I see that suggested somewhere), then have 20 weeks to train for the inaugural Pocono Mtn 70.3, with Oly or Sprint races in every few weeks from week 4 to 16? (NYC Oly, NJ Tri, Philly, Black Bear, and other regional races). or would starting OS on 11/1 and then doing some sort of 8-10 wk program for an Oly I mark as an A race, followed by another 12 week program to close with the Pocano 70.3 be better?
next year I would like to begin training with power. I also need a road/tri bike. I posted in another trial member thread discussing bike v power trainer about this as well. I am more than willing to put the time in trying my best to learn how to race with power, want to make sure I buy the best gear for my budget. I love doing research, but will likely have tons of questions
Thanks!
Hey Coaches,
Would you please let me know how my initial attempt at a 2011 season plan could mesh with EN protocol?
5/3 Bank 25K - 5/14
IM Racine 70.3 - 7/17
Rev3 Cedar Point 140.6 - 9/11
Thanks,
Mike
RnP,
I have been very impressed with your philosophy and I am thinking hard about joining the team. I am doing IM FL 2010 and for 2011 tentatively planning:
70.3 Buffalo Springs
70.3 Austin
When would I start the OS Plan and how would that be integrated into the HIM Plan in preparation for Buffalo Springs? Do you suggest completing all 20 weeks of the OS Plan, first? For example, if I started the OS Plan Jan 4, race day would be 26 weeks away. I also travel a lot for work, but understand we can see the prescribed training sessions for the weeks ahead so modifications can be made accordingly.
Thanks,
Jason
I’ve been trying to figure out when to start, and what to start with.
Here is my story: running my first marathon Jan 16th (signed up and committed to this before I knew EN’s feelings on an OS marathon). During this time I will also be leading 3 CT group rides at my local performance center, instructing 2 TRX classes, swimming 2x per week, and hopefully also getting in a weekly yoga session or two.
I am planning on Honu which is June 4th (my first HIM). There are 20 weeks between the marathon and Honu….so what do I do with those 20 weeks?? Take a couple weeks off and then begin the 12 week 70.3 plan?? Thoughts???
Thanks
Dana
@Michael - Love the questions…keep's coming! I prefer you start OS in OCT, then do an 8 weak-ish build to your OLY. then break and do the HIM plan. There will be some work around making the OLY plan (they are in our hopper) but we'll hook you up for sure. I really like you doing a full proper HIM build to the poconos. And yes to any all races @ end of OS and building to your OLY. Once we hit HIM time we need to be cautious!
@Kelly, given your fall race, yes to the Nov start for sure. Full post marathon recovery please!!! We can massage the schedule to make it work for CDA, but step #1 is emerging from the marathon well rested and healthy!!!
@Mike, I would go with a fun/light fall for now. Maybe a fall century or fun run or run focus. Then start the OS on 1/3. OS ends 5/22, two weeks off ends 6/5. Then 6 weeks to HIM. One week break, then IM training through Cedar Point. The 25 can be part of your OS! Let me know how else we can help!
@Jason, you could start in Dec with the OS after IMFL, giving you a bit more time to get more miles on your legs pre buffalo springs. Dec is a tough motivational time, however, so that would be a Team Member decision methinks. Otherwise a Jan start is fine, we can make that work too!
@Dana -- Holy definition of busy!
Thanks for the response - I just signed on for 2011.
Some random questions while trying to decide on team vs. training plan purchase ....
First, some background. 47 yr old former college swimmer/high school runner been running tri's on and off (mostly off) since 1983. Started to get back in shape about 3 years ago, took it very slowly, first 5 mile running event in about 6 years in summer of 2008. Got a little more serious in begining of 2009, lost some weight, ran HM in May and then entered and finished Steelhead 70.3. Continued on training plan, lost some more weight, ran same HM in 2010 ( 14 min faster) and Steelhead again (35 min improvement). Have always believed in the "higher intensity-less duration" method for swimming and biking, and do a bit of shorter faster runs but mostly just running more, not fast. I've always been self-coached, but I do have a pretty good network of smart folks/coaches that are good at one (swim/bike/run) that I can draw from for single sport ideas and input. I don't have a grand plan in place for 2011, but kicking around a late summer IM -- possibly IM Louisville or Rev 3. Maybe a June/July HM as a test run, and a couple of WTF local events that friends convince me to enter.
Questions: this is what happens when you lurk for a week or so ...
1. How have people who have had some running injury issues handled the intensity of the OS. I've been typically doing some interval training one day/wk and can handle that, but not sure how the body would hold up to more.
2. In the 3 week trial workouts, I see a number of short bricks. Execution of these might be a struggle with current workout limitations, is there any workable substitute, or is the brick critical to the adaptation you're looking for ?
3. What do people who have a long ramp up time for swimming do ? Its taken a long time in the past for me to find some swim form, and I'd hate to give up the one part of the event where I actually feel competent.
4. With a 11/6/10 HM on the schedule and 2011 pretty fluid right now, what OS would you suggest ?
5. Should trial members be able to get in the data tool, and if so, where should I look for some easy to use instructions. I've tried to sign in under the training/data tool tab, but I get "login failed". I did do the 5k run test, and was curious about what the calc might be.
6. I do alot of my OS (former off-season) run training inside on treadmill. Should I test both outside and on treadmill for run, or is there an easy way to adjust from one to the other in your plans ?
Thanks to both of you for the opportunity to take the site for a test drive, and congratulations on your successes. Looking forward to your feedback on the questions, and getting off the fence on the full membership or training plan.
Brian
Thanks for the feedback Pat. I like the idea of full OS to a 8ish week build to an Oly, then a proper HIM plan leading to Poconos.
I see the loaded OS start for me is oct 4, which is in line with what you had suggested in your post. Note that I have my first half marathon on 10/17 (end of week 2 of OS). I read the wiki on doing a half marathon in the OS, and it was very helpful in having me try to structure the first 3 weeks of my OS.
I really look forward to participating in the OS plan!!