Here's
your updated Season Plan, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all
your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This
first post is my best outline of how to proceed with your races, but you can
ask any / all questions you want. So post away, know that I reply here usually
M/W/F each week.
Power User Tip: Click the Star icon by the
Title of this thread to subscribe, and you'll get email updates when I do
reply.
Your
Notes
I've mostly recovered from IM Louisville and didn't run for the first 15 days. Started a running steak on Nov 1 doing mostly short (2-5 miles) runs at TRP. Last week was 26 total miles. I plan to slowly build this up to 30-40 mpw loosely following RDP, but I'm not feeling TPace runs right now. I've been on the bike trainer/zwift at least 2 times a week doing a VO2 and ABP wko. I'm planning to start swimming 2-3x a week. Any suggestions on specific bike workouts between now and OS? I was thinking 1-2 VO2 Max workouts (to "raise the roof") and a 90' - 120' ABP each week until the OS?
I also list the Mallorca Camp as an additional race. Thanks.
Your
Races
04/14/2018 (Training) Mallorca Triathlon Camp
06/03/2018 (Triathlon) IM 70.3 Raleigh
Ironman Lake Placid (2018-07-22) #IMLP_18
Season
Update
These
are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each
one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another
one). You can change your plans on the Training Plan page by clicking the Move /
Change button. Learn more about each plan on the Training Plan Central Page.
Last
updated by Coach on 11/30/2017
On 11/27/2017 Load the -- Run Durability 2 (8 months out) -- 4 weeks to end on 12/24/2017
On 12/25/2017 Load the -- Run Durability 3 (7 months out) -- 4 weeks to end on 1/21/2018
On 1/8/2018 Load the Advanced OutSeason (Run Focus) Plan, 14wks to end on 4/15/2018
On 4/16/2018 Load the -- Swim Camp to end on 4/29/2018
On 4/30/2018 Load the Advanced EN*Full to end on 7/22/2018
On 7/23/2018 Load the -- Post Ironman Transition Plan, All Levels (4wks) to end on 8/19/2018
Coach
Notes
So, you've been hitting it...love it! My advice...just run steady, and not hard ever. Time for that later. Goal would be to add 4 miles per week (ish) to get you close to 40 by end of DEC...but that's really it..maybe 3 weeks at 40 at the end leading up to your 1/8 OS start?
All your energy should be on the bike now...the OS has a good mix of FTP and VO2...I Say that you just race...get in there and really ride...you'll love it and get stronger. Ideally 2 x race during the week and then an ABP ride on the Weekend (there are SAT or Sun options with the Team)...you'll be 100% ready for the OS.
Then we go Run Focus OS (dial bike back a bit and give room for your run to grow), esp as you'll hit Mallorca as the OS ends. Then we go EN*Full Plan right through Raleigh into Placid.
Sounds good! And I also want to thank you for saving my butt on Thursday race this week, you appear at just the right time for me to Bridge back to my group!
LOL. I noticed you there...glad I could help. Those races are very hard. I'm not used to pushing so hard for that long. My IF for that Thursday race and Saturday's Hang On ride were .90/.91 Is this what I need to get used to riding on Zwift? Actually, it's the 1.0 to 1.2 IF surges/hills that wears me down. I'm planning to do 1-2 races a week.
If it’s hard, then it’s something worth working on. A .9 or .91 AF is definitely sustainable for you and is a very easy place for improvement.
Those higher intensity efforts that you speak of are typically more costly for endurance athletes. I know I certainly feel it when we do it, which is probably what makes that weekend ride such a great challenge and social event at the same time. All I see is improvement for you!
@Coach Patrick - Checking in! I wanted to give you an update. I'm in week 12 of JOS and all is going well. I feel my run is in a great place and I haven't done any zone 4 work, just strides a couple days a week. I'm not really feeling the zone 4 workouts (I think it's because I'm not trying to PR any 5K/10K/HM races) so I'm just keeping the Wed runs as a steady TRP run. I was running 7 days a week and ended a 110 day run streak mid-Feb. Now I'm running 6 days a week.
I'm doing A LOT of swimming, like 10,000 -12,000 yds a week on 3 swims. I'm following Tower 26 program as I'm trying to really improve my IM swim time. I've been swimming Monday/Wed/Fridays., which fits the OS well.
The bike improvement is hard to tell progress because this OS I've been on my TT bike (100% aero position during the work intervals). I used my road bike the last two OutSeasons. Between the week 5 and week 9 test, my FTP increased 8 watts to 250. I've been doing the FTP workouts and alternating between the VO2 workout and Zwift racing on Thursdays. On Saturdays, I usually get a quality 2.5 - 3.0 hr ride. Last weekend I put the road bike on the trainer to get ready for Mallorca and that transition is going very well.
I'm still focused on boosting my FTP these next few weeks before jumping into IM plan for IMLP. If you have time to look at my workouts on Strava or TP, I'd appreciate any feedback/suggestions. I think you have my TP log on info. If not I'll send it. Thanks!
Thank you for the update. If you wouldn’t mind, can you remind me of your username for TrainingPeaks? Once I have that I’ll be able to find the password and will look at this on Monday. I think you made some great strides in terms of your death in hopefully a position yourself well to be successful all season, but only time will tell. Chat soon.
@Derrek Sanks Thanks for checking in with me...I just popped over to look at your charts and like what I see there...
Your overall run mileage is so much better than in the past. Your "depth" is looking really good. Thanks to the work you did in Dec/Jan and Feb.
And no real need to add more speed. You are doing very well compared to last year, this time. You are faster across the board except for the 20 to 30 minute range (5k test distance). But who cares!!!!
I know you want to improve your bike power, but this also looks really good. You are stronger on all the quality stuff (shorter than 3') and longer than 30'. So road bike FTP is better for those main intervals, but you aren't very far off at all. My adjustments as you head into the Race Prep phase is to prioritize the FTP work by making sure you are recovered for the session so you can really hit it...and to do it indoors for max effectiveness.
Unsurprisingly, your PMC shows that your fitness is super deep as well...you are not that far off of your peak IM training levels from 2015. IOW, you are fit, and doing great work. We have to be smart as we move into the season so you don't get TOO TIRED but you are on a great path!
@Coach Patrick - Thank you for the feedback!! Copy on all...I'll definitely focus on the FTP workouts. I had a good session of 4x5' this morning. I'll see you in a couple weeks.
Can’t wait to see you in Spain! In the meantime, yes continue to focus on those five minute efforts. If you can raise the the 5 minute Power the others will follow, and so on down the path.
When I said your fitness is “deep” what I’m saying is look at the width of the blue spot on the right-hand side of that PMC chart. Normally you go from Low fitness to high fitness for race day but so far this year you’ve been at a very high level of activity for quite some time. That is both good but also something to be aware of (if you are tired, take a rest day!).
@Coach Patrick - Thanks for the insight...That's interesting. I'll definitely monitor my fatigue/TSB. So for this year I had some "built-in" down time. First a 5 day ski trip and coming home with a cold (but not the flu) in Feb and a week recovery after a HM race in March. I'm planning to take most of next week easy prior to Mallorca. My thoughts for the week after Mallorca is to take 4-6 days off or 1-2 low intensity rides. That should be a good reset as I jump into Wk 9 of IM Plan the following week. Of course I'll listen to any advice you have. Thanks!
Let’s talk when we are at camp. I think you can go super light on the bike when you get back, maybe no bikes for the entire week until Saturday, then we can start getting into some basic, light run frequency so you stay fresh without accumulating too much fatigue.
@Coach Patrick - I hope all is going well. I just wanted to make sure I'm on the right track as I build for IMLP. I had a good recovery after Mallorca (unfortunately I'm not able to do Mallorca next year...son's spring break = college visits). I started at week 9 in the IM Bike Focus plan the week after Mallorca and currently in week 11. Training is going well and I'm keeping the fatigue in check. So far I've been doing Zwift races in place of the Wednesday FTP workout...Is that ok? Typically, I would race, recover for 10 mins then ride at Z2 build to Z3 until the 80-90 min point. My IF for the race is between .99 and 1.02 and total TSS is about the same or more than what's listed in the training plan. I've also been doing the Challenge Ride/Paul's Inside Out ride the last 2 Saturdays on the trainer/Zwift and the ABP ride on Sunday outside or on the trainer. I'm trying not to get sucked into Zwift racing and rides too much and just stick to the training plan (Wed is my race day). Zwift is teaching me that I can ride harder longer and to be comfortable with riding harder, which really helped me in Mallorca. Running is going well. I'm running ~6x a week between 32 and 38 mpw. I'm also swimming 3-4x times a week. If I feel fatigued I drop a Monday or Friday run. Thanks for any feedback.
@Derrek Sanks - bummer on next year, but I totally get it.
As for your training right now I feel like you are perfectly on track. The only thing I see is that you may need to make a teacher Sunday just a steady state ride so you can absorb the work you’re doing on Wednesday and Saturday… Not forgetting the big run during the week as well. So don’t be afraid to step that back. All it means is that the rest of your workouts the following week will be that much better!
Do you have any other bike volume plans outside of the generic training protocol? I’m talking about a weekend or something like that.
@Coach Patrick - I didn't really have plans for a big bike volume but after listening to your last Office Hours, I've been thinking how/where to best add it in. My schedule: 70.3 Raleigh Jun3. After easy/recovery for 5-6 days, I'll be at the start of week 15. Lake Placid Race Camp is in week 16 (I'm planning to attend). Maybe 4 days encompassing Memorial Day weekend, but that could hurt my Raleigh race?? Any suggestions?
Copy on the Sunday steady rides vice ABP. Should I consider it every Sunday or how about doing that every 2-3 weeks, or try to use my fatigue/body as a guide each week? And does a steady ride mean a Zone 2 ride?
@Derrek Sanks - Thanks for following up. It’s important to remember that you already did my order this year, so you already have a good dose of the volume.
I think two good days over memorial day weekend or are you need for the bike. I don’t know what your schedule is like, but I would plan on something like a five hour day and a four hour day. Remember, we don’t want to go too hard / chase race numbers.
Feel free to choose more adventurous to rain just remember it’s writing like we were in Mallorca. Mostly steady/zone two with a couple of good tempo efforts in there or climbs. But that’s it.
I would also plan on a day off! That way you can start to rapidly recover before you head into Raleigh.
For Raleigh week, I would make sure you got your long run in by Wednesday, is with race short on Thursday, Swim long on Friday then race and recover.
We will want you to race Raleigh to the best of your ability, so I like being slightly conservative the week before. Once you’re through the race, we can strategize the rest, but it looks good!
Hey Coach P! Checking back in with an update of the past couple weeks.
- As you suggested I did two back to back longer rides over Memorial Day Weekend. Both were 4 hr rides. - I had a good taper leading into 70.3 Raleigh - The race was bad and good. Bad, bad, bad swim. Solid bike and run. Race report is below but here’s the short version. The swim was my worse-ever since doing triathlon; great bike (9th fastest AG) and great run (2nd fastest AG). Overall, 11th place AG. Results: 5:22 with a :59 swim, 2:38 bike and 1:38 run., https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/24819/derreks-70-3-raleigh-race-report#latest -- Basically, I went out too fast on the swim and got caught up in the mix, then couldn't catch my breath. Ended up stopping/breast stroking several times until things calmed down. I did zero OWSs prior to Raleigh and paid the price. - Recovery was going well until Saturday; but I should be back to full training tomorrow. Monday was rest day. Tuesday I swam; Wednesday I swam and easy 60' bike/spin. Thursday I did 4x9' at FTP (4') and had no issues hitting my power numbers, then 9 mile run later in the day. Friday swam and easy 90' bike. Saturday, 40' run and planned to do the 5 hr Challenge Ride but between fatigue and the heat/humidity, I wasn't hitting my power numbers, over heated and ended the ride at 3.5 hours. Sunday I dropped the ABP ride and did a 1 hr OWS. Tomorrow/Monday will be a swim and easy run, then back at it.
Tomorrow starts Week 15/Camp week, but since I'll be at the Placid Camp, I plan to follow Week 16 this week, then do Week 15 the following week. Is that Ok?
We were following you and we’re totally trying to figure out what was going on with your swim. If you plan on being aggressive like that, you need to have a good 10 to 15 minute in water warmer. Basically you went from 0 to 60 in the water and that’s not good.
But now you know that! I really recommend crushing to swim, especially on a day where it’s going to be so hot. We can talk more strategy in Lake Placid!
I'm still on cloud 9 and super excited about going to Kona! Can't believe that happened. Anyway, I just posted my race report...here
Now, I'm starting to think about training up for another 140.6 race. This will be my first time doing 2 IMs in a year. My recovery is going well and I'm trying to follow the recovery plan for now but haven't been too motivated to do much, so don't look at my Strava. LOL. My overall goal for Kona is to enjoy the "first-timers" experience and have a respectable finish time. Since this will be my first ocean swim and first non-wetsuit IM swim, I plan to increase my swimming from 3 to 4x a week.
Can I get your training recommendations for another IM 11 weeks out? If it's easier I'll submit another Season Plan.
Congratulations again! I love your macro level approach. Are usually tell people to pick one thing to be good at. In your case you sort of have to.
Do you want to get to the swim and you can pick the bike with a run. Giving your strengths on the run, I would recommend that be your focus. The swim plus bike carbonation is pretty fierceand being conservative on the bike will allow you to have a run you can be proud of.
No need to submit a new plan. I suggest that you go back and look at my Strava training log from last year into Kona or from 2015 or 2014 into Kona. You can see the outline of what I have done. There is also the IRONMAN revenge protocol in the wiki if you search those pages.
First order of business is recovery, pretty hard, for two weeks. Then we can ease things back in so that by mid August you can be out there riding 3 to 4 hours and running 60 to 90 minutes. Is that a good enough starting point?
@Coach Patrick - Recovery is going well. It took my run the longest to come around and today was the first time I felt like a runner again. I've decided to follow the Minimalist plan for Kona training. For the Tuesday FTP ride, I'll mostly do a Zwift race or follow the plan. I'll swim 4x and run 5-6x a week. How does that sound? Do you recommend any other adjustments?
Comments
@Derrek Sanks -
Here's your updated Season Plan, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This first post is my best outline of how to proceed with your races, but you can ask any / all questions you want. So post away, know that I reply here usually M/W/F each week.
Power User Tip: Click the Star icon by the Title of this thread to subscribe, and you'll get email updates when I do reply.
Your Notes
I've mostly recovered from IM Louisville and didn't run for the first 15 days. Started a running steak on Nov 1 doing mostly short (2-5 miles) runs at TRP. Last week was 26 total miles. I plan to slowly build this up to 30-40 mpw loosely following RDP, but I'm not feeling TPace runs right now. I've been on the bike trainer/zwift at least 2 times a week doing a VO2 and ABP wko. I'm planning to start swimming 2-3x a week. Any suggestions on specific bike workouts between now and OS? I was thinking 1-2 VO2 Max workouts (to "raise the roof") and a 90' - 120' ABP each week until the OS?
I also list the Mallorca Camp as an additional race. Thanks.Your Races
Season Update
These are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another one). You can change your plans on the Training Plan page by clicking the Move / Change button. Learn more about each plan on the Training Plan Central Page.
Coach Notes
So, you've been hitting it...love it! My advice...just run steady, and not hard ever. Time for that later. Goal would be to add 4 miles per week (ish) to get you close to 40 by end of DEC...but that's really it..maybe 3 weeks at 40 at the end leading up to your 1/8 OS start?
All your energy should be on the bike now...the OS has a good mix of FTP and VO2...I Say that you just race...get in there and really ride...you'll love it and get stronger. Ideally 2 x race during the week and then an ABP ride on the Weekend (there are SAT or Sun options with the Team)...you'll be 100% ready for the OS.
Then we go Run Focus OS (dial bike back a bit and give room for your run to grow), esp as you'll hit Mallorca as the OS ends. Then we go EN*Full Plan right through Raleigh into Placid.
Let me know if you want to talk details...
Let's get to work!
~ Coach P
Thanks for all your help.
Happy Holidays!
I'm doing A LOT of swimming, like 10,000 -12,000 yds a week on 3 swims. I'm following Tower 26 program as I'm trying to really improve my IM swim time. I've been swimming Monday/Wed/Fridays., which fits the OS well.
The bike improvement is hard to tell progress because this OS I've been on my TT bike (100% aero position during the work intervals). I used my road bike the last two OutSeasons. Between the week 5 and week 9 test, my FTP increased 8 watts to 250. I've been doing the FTP workouts and alternating between the VO2 workout and Zwift racing on Thursdays. On Saturdays, I usually get a quality 2.5 - 3.0 hr ride. Last weekend I put the road bike on the trainer to get ready for Mallorca and that transition is going very well.
I'm still focused on boosting my FTP these next few weeks before jumping into IM plan for IMLP. If you have time to look at my workouts on Strava or TP, I'd appreciate any feedback/suggestions. I think you have my TP log on info. If not I'll send it. Thanks!
Thanks.
Your overall run mileage is so much better than in the past. Your "depth" is looking really good. Thanks to the work you did in Dec/Jan and Feb.
And no real need to add more speed. You are doing very well compared to last year, this time. You are faster across the board except for the 20 to 30 minute range (5k test distance). But who cares!!!!
I know you want to improve your bike power, but this also looks really good. You are stronger on all the quality stuff (shorter than 3') and longer than 30'. So road bike FTP is better for those main intervals, but you aren't very far off at all. My adjustments as you head into the Race Prep phase is to prioritize the FTP work by making sure you are recovered for the session so you can really hit it...and to do it indoors for max effectiveness.
Unsurprisingly, your PMC shows that your fitness is super deep as well...you are not that far off of your peak IM training levels from 2015. IOW, you are fit, and doing great work. We have to be smart as we move into the season so you don't get TOO TIRED but you are on a great path!
Onwards...
~ Coach P
I started at week 9 in the IM Bike Focus plan the week after Mallorca and currently in week 11. Training is going well and I'm keeping the fatigue in check. So far I've been doing Zwift races in place of the Wednesday FTP workout...Is that ok? Typically, I would race, recover for 10 mins then ride at Z2 build to Z3 until the 80-90 min point. My IF for the race is between .99 and 1.02 and total TSS is about the same or more than what's listed in the training plan. I've also been doing the Challenge Ride/Paul's Inside Out ride the last 2 Saturdays on the trainer/Zwift and the ABP ride on Sunday outside or on the trainer. I'm trying not to get sucked into Zwift racing and rides too much and just stick to the training plan (Wed is my race day). Zwift is teaching me that I can ride harder longer and to be comfortable with riding harder, which really helped me in Mallorca.
Running is going well. I'm running ~6x a week between 32 and 38 mpw. I'm also swimming 3-4x times a week. If I feel fatigued I drop a Monday or Friday run.
Thanks for any feedback.
Do you have any other bike volume plans outside of the generic training protocol? I’m talking about a weekend or something like that.
Copy on the Sunday steady rides vice ABP. Should I consider it every Sunday or how about doing that every 2-3 weeks, or try to use my fatigue/body as a guide each week? And does a steady ride mean a Zone 2 ride?
Thank you!
Feel free to choose more adventurous to rain just remember it’s writing like we were in Mallorca. Mostly steady/zone two with a couple of good tempo efforts in there or climbs. But that’s it.
For Raleigh week, I would make sure you got your long run in by Wednesday, is with race short on Thursday, Swim long on Friday then race and recover.
We will want you to race Raleigh to the best of your ability, so I like being slightly conservative the week before. Once you’re through the race, we can strategize the rest, but it looks good!
Sounds great! Thanks for the guidance and I'll plan a rest day after the 2 longer rides this weekend. I'll check back after Raleigh.
- As you suggested I did two back to back longer rides over Memorial Day Weekend. Both were 4 hr rides.
- I had a good taper leading into 70.3 Raleigh
- The race was bad and good. Bad, bad, bad swim. Solid bike and run. Race report is below but here’s the short version. The swim was my worse-ever since doing triathlon; great bike (9th fastest AG) and great run (2nd fastest AG). Overall, 11th place AG. Results: 5:22 with a :59 swim, 2:38 bike and 1:38 run., https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/24819/derreks-70-3-raleigh-race-report#latest
-- Basically, I went out too fast on the swim and got caught up in the mix, then couldn't catch my breath. Ended up stopping/breast stroking several times until things calmed down. I did zero OWSs prior to Raleigh and paid the price.
- Recovery was going well until Saturday; but I should be back to full training tomorrow. Monday was rest day. Tuesday I swam; Wednesday I swam and easy 60' bike/spin. Thursday I did 4x9' at FTP (4') and had no issues hitting my power numbers, then 9 mile run later in the day. Friday swam and easy 90' bike. Saturday, 40' run and planned to do the 5 hr Challenge Ride but between fatigue and the heat/humidity, I wasn't hitting my power numbers, over heated and ended the ride at 3.5 hours. Sunday I dropped the ABP ride and did a 1 hr OWS. Tomorrow/Monday will be a swim and easy run, then back at it.
Tomorrow starts Week 15/Camp week, but since I'll be at the Placid Camp, I plan to follow Week 16 this week, then do Week 15 the following week. Is that Ok?
I hope you're enjoyed Colorado and Ragnar!
But now you know that! I really recommend crushing to swim, especially on a day where it’s going to be so hot. We can talk more strategy in Lake Placid!
Thanks.
No need to submit a new plan. I suggest that you go back and look at my Strava training log from last year into Kona or from 2015 or 2014 into Kona. You can see the outline of what I have done. There is also the IRONMAN revenge protocol in the wiki if you search those pages.
First order of business is recovery, pretty hard, for two weeks. Then we can ease things back in so that by mid August you can be out there riding 3 to 4 hours and running 60 to 90 minutes. Is that a good enough starting point?
Thanks