Hey @Coach Patrick , I also posted these in the Nov OS Bike week 3 forum, but I wasn't sure if it was better here. The 2nd question I'm going to put in the "General Q and A" forum too (probably best there), but I included it here in the event you wanted to share insight on it.
Major question for the group (and maybe better for my @Coach Patrick micro forum?): My buddy is coming to my town to do a cycle cross race Saturday. I've never done one, but I actually have a hand-me-down cyclecross bike (that I used for commuting, triathlon & road racing before I slowly accumulated 3 more bikes) that I really like. I would like to do this cyclecross race on Saturday. My short-term competitive side would like to tone down Thursday's workout so I can really hammer Saturday. But thinking about my long-term progress, I know the VO2 max workout on Thursdays is really critical. Should I:
1) Tone down Thursday's workout & go all out Saturday? 2) Do the VO2 max work Thursday and try to race easy on Saturday within like Zone 3 HR? 3) Do the VO2 max work Thursday go all out Saturday (worried about burnout here)? 4) Something else all together?
Also, have you ever used P1 power-tap pedals in rain & mud where they are jumping on and off the bike a lot (like during a late season CX race?)?
I just posted some more specific goals for 2018 & OS in the Nov. OS. I'm copying here so they are handy:
OS Goals:
Get power meter (check) and FTP (check); looks like it is ~247 W (crank arm length may not be right in my data recorder (172.5 default vs. 175 actual).
Establish, maintain run streak (going for 5k/day for 100 days). I've gone 30 days with only missing one day, 18 consecutive days.
Bike focus OS: Come out of winter with top bike fitness & hunt down some KOMs (or as close as possible) on Strava in early season.
Barry Roubaix Killer Gravel Road race March 2018 (I've done this a couple times & it is a big fun race).
One of @Al truscotts comments suggested people going through their first OS could see a 15% improvement. So I guess I shoot for a 15% improvement in my FTP? . I say that knowing that I'm coming off of 3 months of just running and no biking and knowing I only just started biking again March 2017 after not biking seriously since 2012. So that would be 284 watts.
Keep % body fat under 12%
Work on swim form & efficiency. Swim weekly. Compete in the USMS 1 hour postal swim. I did this in 2012. Can I beat my distance? Long shot if I'm bike/run focused, but we'll see. I just found out I'm only about 18 miles from 100 miles of swimming for the year, so I may go for that (I didn't swim in January & only a tiny bit in February)
Run a fast 5k/10k. Since I"m in bike-focused OS, I don't want to set a super ambitious run goal. I have pretty great run durability (for me), so keep this. If I can rebuild/maintain the run fitness I had in October at the end of OS with big bike improvements, that will be awesome.
2018 season:
A-races: 6/24/18 CdA 70.3; 8/12/18 Steelhead 70.3; another fall 70.3 (most likely Waco 10/28/18, but maybe NOLA or Miami)
B-race: Great Lakes Relay 2018 (I'll be looking for fun athletes to add to my 10 person team. http://greatlakesrelay.com/
B-races: Maybe a some olympic tris, some OS swim events, or local run races.
70.3 season goal: Go for IM All World Athlete (AWA) Silver or Gold in 70.3 distance. I've only done one 70.3 before (Steelhead 2017). If I score at least as well in my 3*2018 70.3 races, then I should get silver. I think gold is within reach.
2018 run goal: Run a flat 70.3 run split that is at BQ pace (setting me up for a 2019 BQ).
How high can I place in my age group in a 70.3? Maybe top 10? I was ~20th place this year and I will age group up next year.
Can I get a roll-down for a 70.3 World Championship. South Africa slots seem to roll down far, but I'd only have 2 months to plan the trip from the 6/24/18 CdA 70.3. Need to do some research.
I recorded the power with the power-tap phone app because my Suunto Ambit 2S wasn't reliably displaying the data. Neither one has a place to enter crank arm length. The manual says default setting for the pedals is 172.5, and my crank is 175. So my power data may be precise, but less accurate for a bit.
VO2 (5 min): 303 W 10 min rest FTP (20 min): 247 W, so I guess my FTP is 95% of that (235 W)
I didn't pace my effort evenly across the intervals (See HR data graph), but I'm happy I finished strong (see attached HR data). Prior to this power testing business:
My zone 3 bike HR: 126-132
My zone 4 bike HR: 132-141
zone 5: 142-145
What HR bike zone do people usually average during an VO2 and FTP test? I was
141/156 (avg/max) bpm for VO2 (top of zone 4; maybe rode conservatively here?)
136/152 (avg/max) bpm for FTP (high zone 4)
I just put this in the EN bike calculator & that suggested I was kinda flat based on HR for this test (it lowered all my HR zones significantly). So hopefully that will mean big improvement in the future.
@Larry Peters - That is great work! All across the board. I don’t have any edits for you other than to suggest you entered your run pace and bike FTP into the 2018 heads and tails sheet or I will give you targets myself. That’s one of the things we do in the winter, and you will find them under training plan central in the outseason section. Your first test is a good one, now we begin the process of wrapping it up! Looking forward to it!
Hey @Coach Patrick , awesome, thanks! I'll enter stuff in the heads & tails sheet soon! Question about big training volume push in early June 2018.
I'm trying to arrange to have next summer have minimal work obligations. Things are looking good. If I can pull it off, I want to head "out west" for June to get my final 1-2 big volume weeks and taper in before my first A-race 70.3 CdA. (Looking in the CO area, since I have friends in Denver, Loveland & Boulder I might be able to stay with, or in the Idaho area, since my first race in in ID).
I'm looking for fun, epic stuff to do in the mountains as part of my 1-2 weeks of volume push in early June. I got on the Al'T'Tude camp wait-list for early June. So we'll see.
I also found this "Ride the Rockies," and it sounds epic and awesome. But it ends (on 6/15) only 10 days before my A-race (6/24) and it sounds like it may be tough to get a spot in the tour. If I could get a spot in the tour, would this be too much training stress too close to my first A-race?
Sounds good, I’ll look forward to seeing your data. We are going to have a great winter.
Don’t forget we have our Blue Ridge training camp in May which would be early enough for you.
I think the depth of that Rockies ride would be too much. But there’s nothing to stop you from going to Boulder, staying in an Airbnb, and pulling down a bunch of routes into your Garman as you love life. It depends how independent you are. We can support you no matter what you choose keep me posted.
Hey @Coach Patrick , Funny, I was just thinking tonight during my daily 5k that the Rockies ride would probably be too many miles even if the timing was perfect (especially considering I'm focused on 70.3 distance).
I would LOVE to do the Blue Ridge camp (or any EN camp, really). But I am slammed with work until 5/14, then I'm hopefully taking a class of college students to Costa Rica for work (teaching a "Introduction to Tropical Ecology" 5/14-5/27). If I can't recruit enough students to pay the $3600 price tag & my class falls through (which I'll find out in February), then Blue Ridge would be great!
Yeah, if things go as planned, I'll probably go out to Boulder area & just spend a couple weeks in training heaven . One Boulder buddy is an ultramarathoner and IM finisher, so I can workout w/ him and another buddy is into mountain biking. When the dates draw nearer, I'll see if there are any EN teammates in the area that might want to meet up.
I'm pretty sure my first FTP test is not reliable. I changed the setting from 172.5 mm crank arm length to 175 mm crank arm length & I was crushing my Watts numbers during yesterday's workout (better sleep was a big factor too). Do you still want me to enter the old FTP in the heads/tails numbers? Also, I did not do a run test the first week, so I'll just plan to enter next week's run test in the week 5 spot.
I was wondering if I should tentatively plan a 4th 70.3 next season in my calendar? My goal is to get silver or gold AWA status. If I happen to get sick during one of the 3*70.3's I have scheduled, or have a bad day or something, then it will really hurt my numbers. So having a 4th race in the calendar could take pressure off the other three (however, it could also spread me too thin).
Right now, my 3*70.3 =
CdA 6/24
Steelhead 8/12
Waco 10/28
I could add in Atlantic City (I have a good buddy who is also a triathlete in Phili) 70.3 on 9/23. It is 6 weeks from Steelhead, so enough time to recover, have a week or two of training & then taper again. If I crush it at A/C, then I could just do Waco "for fun," and not worry as much about keeping up high level training through the fall. If I feel burned out when A/C comes, I can just do it "for fun," recharge, and focus on Waco.
My buddy said we could split a hotel room, and he lives in Phili, only 1 hour from Atlantic City. I've been wanting to visit him anyway.
If one of my first 3 races don't go well, then I have Waco as a back-up to score more points toward AWA.
X I say we see what your week five numbers are in the sheet and I will go from there.
I am torn on the four races. At some point your year becomes more of just surviving as opposed to going fast. That’s fine, but it might not be what you are seeking.
To put it another way, I think it will be an epic and fun year. But if some part of you was wishing that you would crack a certain time, that schedule may not be the way to do it.
Sweet, ok, thanks @Coach Patrick !! I do want to race fast & try to get AWA gold (and maybe a spot in Nice 70.3 world championships as a stretch goal). I don't want to get into a mode of just surviving. I have put myself there before. I'm sure I will again, but I want to try to avoid it.
I have not registered for the Waco race in late October. What if I switch my 3 * A races to CdA, Steelhead and Atlantic City (that was one of the original season options we discussed and would require me maintaining a full 70.3 training volume during less of my fall semester (fall being a much more busy time than summer))?
Then, if one of the races doesn't go well, OR if I'm really craving to do another race, I could always add Waco later on.
Thanks for the reminder about some races not selling out. I just don't have a good sense of which ones will & which ones won't. I know Steelhead doesn't typically sell out. But Mount Tremblant 70.3 sold out quickly and that was a bummer, because I would've loved to do it. Since I'm pretty focused on certain date options based on optimizing my calendar, I want to make sure I don't get frozen out of one of the race dates I'm hoping to do. ALSO, if I know I plan to do a race, I'd rather save money by registering earlier.
Plus, going to Phili to race with my buddy in late September (in Atlantic City) sounds pretty sweet. He said he would do Waco with me, but I'm skeptical how serious he is about that**. But if I go to his home region to race, he won't have an excuse not to race w/ me.
Honestly, I'm also torn. But I like the idea of not having to count on late October being one of my "A" races. Wrapping the season up a bit earlier is appealing, and knowing I have a "back-up" race I can do if I want/need to is also appealing.
**Additional details; reasons I'm skeptical my buddy will follow-through on Waco: He also plans to do the Challenged Athlete Foundation race in San Diego in early October (which is almost a half IM distance). So I'd be surprised if he stuck to his text message and turned around & did Waco 70.3 in late October.
I do like the idea of stacking of your season earlier. There are benefits not just for the late season flexibility, but for the advantage of the compounded training plus racing affect.
I hate Waco is new? So not sure but Texas population does love Triathlon. I don’t think AC sells out but that’s a better question for the dashboard.
Thanks @Coach Patrick , I like the idea of stacking too!
I started a thread on this & got some good feedback. @Robert Sabo said Atlantic City (AC) typically sells out mid-summer. @Scott Alexander thinks Waco will sell out (first year of event).
I think I'm going to book AC and go with that. I think the advantages of that outweigh the other plan. I like having "late season flexibility." I'll probably register within the next couple weeks to save $30.
Hey @Coach Patrick , sorry, I'm way overdue for updating you and for updating the OS data sheets (I plan to add data soon)!
My week 5 FTP test was a bit of a fail. I wasn't recovered enough. I had an ok 5 min VO2 test (significantly improved relative to the test 2 weeks prior with the incorrect crank arm setting): 328 Watts for 5 min. But I hit the wall between 10-15 minutes & bailed so I could recover. Based on the VO2 test, and the tests I did prior (with the incorrect crank arm settings), I've been working out as if my FTP is ~250 Watts and watching my HR, and it seems to be going well. If I can do 328 for 5 minutes, 250 Watts sounds like it *should* be conservative.
For the first ~5 weeks of OS, I was too stressed from work, not sleeping enough, and probably doing too many level 3 workouts, when combined with lifting, swimming and bike commuting. I pretty much never made it through a whole week without hitting the wall and having to bail on a workout.
But, this past week training went really well! I came off of a week of just running my 5k and bike commuting (because I had to focus all extra time on work for the week), and I tried to do more level 1 workouts to avoid burn out.
I've done 9 consecutive days of every workout on the scheduled day, and I've been able to hit goal Watts & HR really well at every workout. I honestly was going to cancel Sunday's long and just do a 5k w/ strides, because I wanted to swim a bit & get a big leg lift (pre-hab/re-hab/durability). But I was feeling good & got a whole Level 1 Sunday quality run in with solid Z4 intervals (Z4 HR with Z5+ pace (granted, only for 2*0.5 miles, on an indoor 200M track, but considering I didn't think I'd be up for any hard running, this was great news!). And I still felt pretty good today for a swim and my daily 5k.
Also good news: Late December to early April work should be less demanding, so I should be able to train really well. Mid April to late May will be more of a challenge.
Anyway, my most immediate question regarding my season: As we've discussed before, I'm going to Costa Rica to teach a class from 5/14-5/27 and my first A-race is CdA 70.3 on 6/24. As we discussed, I probably won't be able to bike much during those two weeks (and probably have reduced total training volume), but hopefully I will get some quality runs in and have my stretch cordz for swim simulation training. When I brought this up before, you weren't too worried about it.
Recently, Al Truscott said he had a spot open up for his AlT'tude camp starting 6/2. I'm super pumped because being a part of that that sounds awesome! Do you think it would be ok to head to that Al T'Tude camp after not biking much (or at all) from 5/14-5/27? I was thinking that would be an awesome volume pop during my last week of hard training before taper. It will probably be harder to get in swims and runs, but hopefully I can get them in.
Also, I noticed Cozumel 70.3 times were a lot less competitive in my AG than the Atlantic City times. I'm guessing part of that is the huge population density near A/C and the inconvenience of a destination race like Cozumel. But maybe it is the heat? They are only 1 week apart, so I was considering doing Cozumel instead of Atlantic City if it increased my chances of placing high (for more AWA points and a better chance of a World Championship slot). What do you think about doing Cozumel 70.3 instead of Atlantic City 70.3 because it seems less competitive?
PS. I looked again regarding that last question: Cozumel might actually have been a bit more competitive than Atlantic City (based on times in my future AG) in the top 10 spots (#10 was 4:47 AC and 4:44 in Cozumel and #6 was 4:40 in AC but 4:37 in Cozumel), but in the places from 10-20, AC was more competitive (15th place was 4:52:39 in AC and 4:59:33 in Cozumel).
Is this worth considering, or are those differences not that big of a deal? AC would be cheaper...
Thanks for the update, and I’m really excited that you’re getting a good groove with your training.
Don’t get down on yourself, it can often take quite a while for a new schedule adjusted. And besides, we are not in race season so it only makes sense that other things in our lives take a greater level of priority. Kudos to you for staying consistent through it and still finding some silver linings.
I think having you go to the camp in Colorado was great, and I wouldn’t get too stressed about what it means to put together the perfect race. It’s not like you need to hit a certain number of some bikes and runs every week in order to be a triathlete. The games that you will get from that bike volume significantly outweigh the value of a standard taper week into a race. You can always cram in the swim in the last week, and I fully expect you to have a good run Fitness thanks for the help. Consider it an adventure!
Speaking of adventures, I don’t think I would try to do Cozumel. That’s a lot of time and money when you can get a similar experience and do very well for yourself in Atlantic City. Remember, you are making decisions on performances using last year’s data for the competition and for yourself. My guess is that you will be significantly stronger in a few months! Not to mention smarter.
Hey @Coach Patrick , follow up to the Al'T Tude camp: I've paid for my spot. I'm SUPER pumped!
When we discussed me doing that camp, were you assuming I would do the Snowmass Ragnar at the end?
I would LOVE to, but don't want to add too much stress to the system only ~2 weeks from my first A race on 6/24.
Looking at the calendar, the Ragnar is 6/8 & 6/9, and my first 70.3 is 6/24, so that gives me 15 full days to taper. That seems ok to me. What do you think?
As of now, the group might not have slots for runners anyway (14 campers & 12 slots for runners). But some people may have to drop out.
I guess I could always camp out with everyone and run support for people actually running in the relay if there are no slots.
Hey @Coach Patrick , I finally submitted my TSR request. I know you'll need some time before you can fill it out. We already discussed much of my race season, but I have a few specific questions.
I'm making some slight edits to this 2:28 pm 1/23. ~15 hours after original post, so I'm hoping you didn't already read it.
First, RE, TSR: I forgot to include a gravel road bike race "Barry Roubaix" on 4/21. It has a fair bit of climbing (for MI) on rolling hills. They have 22, 36 & 62 mile races. I'm thinking the 36 would be best for me, since I'm focused on 70.3, and it will be on hilly gravel roads, so will take longer.
Second, In between OS & 70.3 program: I listened to the "rest of your season" 6 min audio w/ Coach Rich (~week 12 of OS). He said to plan to be in the 70.3 program for 8-10 weeks prior to your race. My first 70.3 is 6/24. So 10 weeks from that is 3/15.
So, I have 10 weeks between the end of my OS & the "10 weeks" from my first 70.3 (20 weeks total).
I'm guessing swim camp will be 2 weeks of that. I've been swimming a bit & hope to continue to build that. I'm mostly focusing on increasing stroke rate & drills to improve form & strength.
Should I do 2 weeks of swim camp, 10 weeks of Get Faster & 8 weeks of 70.3 program pre-CdA 70.3 on 6/24? OR 2 weeks of swim camp, 8 weeks of Get Faster & 10 weeks of 70.3 program? Keep in mind I'll probably have a training drop during the last 2/4 high volume weeks prior to my race (2 weeks in Costa Rica, 1 week transition, 1 week of Al TTude camp, then 2 weeks of taper).
Third: I will go to Costa Rica 5/14-5/27 and then come back to do Al T-Tude camp on 6/2. I will have limited bike time in Costa Rica (and maybe limited training time overall). But i hope to keep running some (hopefully daily), doing core work and take my stretch cords for swim simulations. Should I go easy during the 5 days between Costa Rica and 6/2 snowmass camp, go medium, or go hard since my taper will be approaching quickly?
Fourth: I want to go backpacking for a week or so after my 6/24 70.3 My next A race isn't until 8/12, so I figured that would be ok. Do you agree? I can run during that time too, just no biking.
BTW, based on today's zwift race, I"m able to push & hold my HR higher on the bike (2 bpm) than my bike test last spring. I know lower HR is better, but I think this is a sign that my legs are more powerful & I can push my body harder on the bike.
My old Zone 4 was 132-141 .
You told me last year that my run & bike HR zones should become closer over time, so I'm happy to see this! I never tested again all summer, so I don't know what the HR zones would have been in August at my peak, but I know that this is a sign of big progress since getting back on the bike in 11/1.
Here's
your updated Season Plan, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all
your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This
first post is my best outline of how to proceed with your races, but you can
ask any / all questions you want. So post away, know that I reply here usually
M/W/F each week.
Power User Tip: Click the Star icon by the
Title of this thread to subscribe, and you'll get email updates when I do
reply.
Your
Notes
I've been keeping a 5k per day running streak for 83 days. I've been following the Nov OS pretty closely, with some deviations from work/travel/recovery/skiing. I've done more Level 1-2 workouts. Sometimes when I feel good, I do a Level 3 workout.
I did my first 70.3 in August, ran 2 marathons in 2017 (my first 2), and a 25k.
I did about 8 olympic tris in 2009-2010, but 2017 was my first year back to triathlon. I started swimming & biking (almost from scratch) in March 2017 on EN plans. I started running again seriously in July 2016.
Your
Races
"Barry Roubaix" on 4/21 - 36 miler bike
Costa Rica 5/14-5/27 Travel (Run and Core)
Al T-Tude camp on 6/2 to 6/9
06/24/2018 - 70.3 CDA
07/20/2018 - 07/22/2018 Great Lakes Relay (3 day, 10 person relay race, but NOT overnight. We sleep each night). Typically ~30 miles of hard trail running in 3 days.
These
are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each
one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another
one). You can change your plans on the Training Plan page by clicking the Move /
Change button. Learn more about each plan on the Training Plan Central Page.
Last updated by Coach on 01/25/2018
End December OutSeason® on 3/11/2018
On 3/12/2018 Load the -- Swim Camp to end on 3/25/2018
On 3/26/2018 Load the Bike Focus Block, 6 Weeks to end on 5/6/2018
On 5/7/2018 Load the EN*Half Plan (L2-L3 workouts) to end on 6/24/2018
70.3 CDA
On 6/25/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 7/8/2018
>> Transition Early <<
On 07/01/2018 Load the EN*Half (L3 workouts) to end on 8/12/2018
On 8/13/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 8/19/2018
On 8/20/2018 Load the EN*Half (L3 workouts) to end on 9/23/2018
On 9/24/2018 Load the -- Post Half Iron Transition Plan, All Levels (2wks) to end on 10/07/2018
Coach
Notes
Rob, the plan is up ^above^. I think I sorted through your request and all the notes we have here to complete the most recent list of events / dates / focus points. Since you have a long year, I don't want you to go nuts on the Half work in March with your last half in August. Too long! So we have Swim Camp and the Bike Focus block (prep you for Al Camp, you'll need to work in one long ride a week here on the weekends).
You'll have a few weeks to dial in your first half, then recover (a week!) and then back to a Half (through Great Lakes, etc).
Hey @Coach Patrick , awesome thanks a million! I'm super pumped to have this, but I feel like an idiot. It looks like I left off one of my A-races somehow, 9/23 Atlantic city 70.3 (its even in my signature below, not sure how I missed it). Maybe there was a technical glitch or something, but probably user-error. Should I resubmit a TSR request, or just add the updates here? Luckily, this is at the end of the season, so it shouldn't dramatically change the plan you already provided.
Sorry I mentioned a question related to this in another forum. I was being over-eager, and I figured I'd leverage the knowledge of the team while I waited for my TSR. Also, my bad for not requesting the TSR sooner.
I"m excited to stay in OS & keep getting faster! I'm glad I checked. Your TSR is definitely different than what I was imagining, so I'm really glad to have your guidance!
One question about the TSR posted above:
Should "On 6/25/2018 Load the EN*Half (L3 workouts) to end on 8/12/2018" read "On 7/8/2018 Load the EN*Half (L3 workouts) to end on 8/12/2018"
And the information I apparently left off my TSR:
I am also doing Atlantic City 70.3 on 9/23/18
I agree it is a long season, and you warned me about this before. That is part of the reason we chose 9/23/18 70.3 instead of Waco 70.3 in late October. But I am going for an AWA status (hopefully silver or gold). So I need to do at least 3 events.
One new question I have since submitting my TSR. Since I've been running everyday & enjoying the benefits, I'm eager to continue this running. I'm contemplating bringing my weekly running miles up to 39/week, which would get me close to 2018 miles in 2018 (I could easily make up the difference by adding in some running volume pops during IM build, and/or during post-season October-December 2018). My plan of attack would be to average 36 miles/week for the next couple weeks, and then to increase it to 39 miles/week (like the approach outlined in RDP info).
Relevant info:
My weekly average running mileage since 10/6 is 30.9 miles
Last 4 weeks weekly running mileage:
1/8
33.6
1/15
33.5
1/22
37.2
1/29
35.4
Would adding a goal of averaging 39 miles/week of running through to September be a bad idea, good idea, or neutral for my HIM performance? As recommended in "adding volume" guidelines from EN, I would add extra miles by running more time at TRP on "off days" and not make long runs longer than recommended during HIM plan and not extending Z3/4/5 time. I've been running 5k per day everyday for almost 100 days, so I could make that more like 4-5 base miles per day.
I've been using the star-power tip to get email updates on the most relevant threads for a while. Thanks a ton for making sure I knew about it!
And thanks a million for your continued coaching, mentorship, guidance & inspiration!
I updated your Roadmap with AC, no worries...you were only throwing around 6 or 7 possible races. Nice to know even you are confused!
The Post Race Transition plan after CDA should only last a week before re-entering the final few weeks...that's why it says "Transition Early"
That's a lot of run miles just so you can have run miles. I like you running but as we've seen with your foot, we all have limits. For a HIM season, 30 miles a week AVG is FANTASTIC...so stick with that as a baseline, with a bigger week every now and then. Once you are through AC we can do the math on the remainder and what you want to set.
Hey @Coach Patrick , that sounds great! Yeah, sorry about so many races! Thanks a million for working with me on it!
Regarding weekly mileage, that sounds smart. I did notice you said in your injury video that ~35 miles running per week is a limit for you, so that helped put things in perspective. Reminds me to #StayHumble and take baby steps.
Re: Post race transition, I"m not sure why I was confused about that before. I re-read your original comment and it is very clear now. I guess I was tired when I read it the first time..? Sorry about that!
Awesome, thanks! I'll keep shooting for ~30 running miles per week.
Yes, I'm trying to shift to being an earlier bird so it is easier to zwift with all of you! I got to bed 2 hours earlier than usual last night as a birthday present to myself!
Hey @Coach Patrick , I have a question about the bike focus block as it relates to this comment you made above: "you'll need to work in one long ride a week here on the weekends"
Currently, as part of OS I'm doing 2.5-3.5 hour rides on Saturday's as part of the Saturday Long ride (the level 3 EN OS bike focus Saturday workout in Zwift is ~3hr20 min with all the warm up stuff: 12 min Z3 test & 30 min @ Z2). In the bike focus plan, the longest ride is 120 minutes on Sundays.
Does 120 minutes qualify as the "long ride" you reference in your comment? I'm assuming "long" is in the context of being prepared for the Al-T'Tude camp (I'm SO excited!). I imagine we'll get going on much longer rides during that week. So how long should my weekly "long ride" be during the bike focus block? Is 2.5-3.5 hours enough?
I assume this would best be done on Sundays as an extension of the 120 min Sunday ride already in the bike workout plan?
Another important question: I notice the swim camp comes right before the 6 week bike block. I also see the 6 week bike block does not have ANY swimming, and I exit that into my EN half plan. Shouldn't I do the 6 week bike block and THEN the swim camp? (Rather than swim focus for 2 weeks, and then not swim much for another 6 weeks). I read that swim camp is also about "resetting the legs," so I see the value in that.
I plan on maintaining some swimming throughout regardless. But it seems to make more sense to do the bike focus block & then swim camp before getting into EN half plan.
@Larry Peters - thanks for checking in. Some chips and to be a recovery. After I get out season. If you don’t need that recovery and refined to continue then go for it. I assume we would modify the bike for this plan, which continues to trend of high-quality so I can I have to go season, compounding effect, into your camp. By no means did I intend for you to follow the plan just as written without modification given the uniqueness of your season.
Personally, I would like to see you Do swim camp and recover from the outseason before you go to the rest of your year. Add Swims on Monday and Friday into the bike with this plan has it done and out season, and to be extended out Saturday ride to the 3 1/2 hour mark. What do you think?
Comments
Major question for the group (and maybe better for my @Coach Patrick micro forum?): My buddy is coming to my town to do a cycle cross race Saturday. I've never done one, but I actually have a hand-me-down cyclecross bike (that I used for commuting, triathlon & road racing before I slowly accumulated 3 more bikes) that I really like. I would like to do this cyclecross race on Saturday. My short-term competitive side would like to tone down Thursday's workout so I can really hammer Saturday. But thinking about my long-term progress, I know the VO2 max workout on Thursdays is really critical. Should I:
1) Tone down Thursday's workout & go all out Saturday?
2) Do the VO2 max work Thursday and try to race easy on Saturday within like Zone 3 HR?
3) Do the VO2 max work Thursday go all out Saturday (worried about burnout here)?
4) Something else all together?
Also, have you ever used P1 power-tap pedals in rain & mud where they are jumping on and off the bike a lot (like during a late season CX race?)?
Thanks!
OS Goals:
- Get power meter (check) and FTP (check); looks like it is ~247 W (crank arm length may not be right in my data recorder (172.5 default vs. 175 actual).
- Establish, maintain run streak (going for 5k/day for 100 days). I've gone 30 days with only missing one day, 18 consecutive days.
- Bike focus OS: Come out of winter with top bike fitness & hunt down some KOMs (or as close as possible) on Strava in early season.
- Barry Roubaix Killer Gravel Road race March 2018 (I've done this a couple times & it is a big fun race).
- One of @Al truscotts comments suggested people going through their first OS could see a 15% improvement. So I guess I shoot for a 15% improvement in my FTP?
. I say that knowing that I'm coming off of 3 months of just running and no biking and knowing I only just started biking again March 2017 after not biking seriously since 2012. So that would be 284 watts. - Keep % body fat under 12%
- Work on swim form & efficiency. Swim weekly. Compete in the USMS 1 hour postal swim. I did this in 2012. Can I beat my distance? Long shot if I'm bike/run focused, but we'll see. I just found out I'm only about 18 miles from 100 miles of swimming for the year, so I may go for that (I didn't swim in January & only a tiny bit in February)
- Run a fast 5k/10k. Since I"m in bike-focused OS, I don't want to set a super ambitious run goal. I have pretty great run durability (for me), so keep this. If I can rebuild/maintain the run fitness I had in October at the end of OS with big bike improvements, that will be awesome.
2018 season:I recorded the power with the power-tap phone app because my Suunto Ambit 2S wasn't reliably displaying the data. Neither one has a place to enter crank arm length. The manual says default setting for the pedals is 172.5, and my crank is 175. So my power data may be precise, but less accurate for a bit.
VO2 (5 min): 303 W
10 min rest
FTP (20 min): 247 W, so I guess my FTP is 95% of that (235 W)
I didn't pace my effort evenly across the intervals (See HR data graph), but I'm happy I finished strong (see attached HR data). Prior to this power testing business:
- My zone 3 bike HR: 126-132
- My zone 4 bike HR: 132-141
- zone 5: 142-145
What HR bike zone do people usually average during an VO2 and FTP test? I was- 141/156 (avg/max) bpm for VO2 (top of zone 4; maybe rode conservatively here?)
- 136/152 (avg/max) bpm for FTP (high zone 4)
I just put this in the EN bike calculator & that suggested I was kinda flat based on HR for this test (it lowered all my HR zones significantly). So hopefully that will mean big improvement in the future.185 pounds = 83.9 kg
FTP/kg = 2.80
I'm trying to arrange to have next summer have minimal work obligations. Things are looking good. If I can pull it off, I want to head "out west" for June to get my final 1-2 big volume weeks and taper in before my first A-race 70.3 CdA. (Looking in the CO area, since I have friends in Denver, Loveland & Boulder I might be able to stay with, or in the Idaho area, since my first race in in ID).
I'm looking for fun, epic stuff to do in the mountains as part of my 1-2 weeks of volume push in early June. I got on the Al'T'Tude camp wait-list for early June. So we'll see.
I also found this "Ride the Rockies," and it sounds epic and awesome. But it ends (on 6/15) only 10 days before my A-race (6/24) and it sounds like it may be tough to get a spot in the tour. If I could get a spot in the tour, would this be too much training stress too close to my first A-race?
http://www.ridetherockies.com/
I'm sure it might make it tough to get many quality runs and swims in during that time as well. Which could be a problem.....
How beneficial or detrimental would Ride the Rockies be to my 6/24 race?
I can also just do lots of self-directed (and maybe group) workouts during that time.
I looked in the epic forum, and found cycling escapes to be a good option, but they don't have anything starting in early June.
THANKS!
I would LOVE to do the Blue Ridge camp (or any EN camp, really). But I am slammed with work until 5/14, then I'm hopefully taking a class of college students to Costa Rica for work (teaching a "Introduction to Tropical Ecology" 5/14-5/27). If I can't recruit enough students to pay the $3600 price tag & my class falls through (which I'll find out in February), then Blue Ridge would be great!
Yeah, if things go as planned, I'll probably go out to Boulder area & just spend a couple weeks in training heaven
- I'm pretty sure my first FTP test is not reliable. I changed the setting from 172.5 mm crank arm length to 175 mm crank arm length & I was crushing my Watts numbers during yesterday's workout (better sleep was a big factor too). Do you still want me to enter the old FTP in the heads/tails numbers? Also, I did not do a run test the first week, so I'll just plan to enter next week's run test in the week 5 spot.
- I was wondering if I should tentatively plan a 4th 70.3 next season in my calendar? My goal is to get silver or gold AWA status. If I happen to get sick during one of the 3*70.3's I have scheduled, or have a bad day or something, then it will really hurt my numbers. So having a 4th race in the calendar could take pressure off the other three (however, it could also spread me too thin).
Right now, my 3*70.3 =I could add in Atlantic City (I have a good buddy who is also a triathlete in Phili) 70.3 on 9/23. It is 6 weeks from Steelhead, so enough time to recover, have a week or two of training & then taper again. If I crush it at A/C, then I could just do Waco "for fun," and not worry as much about keeping up high level training through the fall. If I feel burned out when A/C comes, I can just do it "for fun," recharge, and focus on Waco.
My buddy said we could split a hotel room, and he lives in Phili, only 1 hour from Atlantic City. I've been wanting to visit him anyway.
If one of my first 3 races don't go well, then I have Waco as a back-up to score more points toward AWA.
Thoughts? Thanks!
I have not registered for the Waco race in late October. What if I switch my 3 * A races to CdA, Steelhead and Atlantic City (that was one of the original season options we discussed and would require me maintaining a full 70.3 training volume during less of my fall semester (fall being a much more busy time than summer))?
Then, if one of the races doesn't go well, OR if I'm really craving to do another race, I could always add Waco later on.
Thanks for the reminder about some races not selling out. I just don't have a good sense of which ones will & which ones won't. I know Steelhead doesn't typically sell out. But Mount Tremblant 70.3 sold out quickly and that was a bummer, because I would've loved to do it. Since I'm pretty focused on certain date options based on optimizing my calendar, I want to make sure I don't get frozen out of one of the race dates I'm hoping to do. ALSO, if I know I plan to do a race, I'd rather save money by registering earlier.
Plus, going to Phili to race with my buddy in late September (in Atlantic City) sounds pretty sweet. He said he would do Waco with me, but I'm skeptical how serious he is about that**. But if I go to his home region to race, he won't have an excuse not to race w/ me.
Honestly, I'm also torn. But I like the idea of not having to count on late October being one of my "A" races. Wrapping the season up a bit earlier is appealing, and knowing I have a "back-up" race I can do if I want/need to is also appealing.
**Additional details; reasons I'm skeptical my buddy will follow-through on Waco: He also plans to do the Challenged Athlete Foundation race in San Diego in early October (which is almost a half IM distance). So I'd be surprised if he stuck to his text message and turned around & did Waco 70.3 in late October.
I hate Waco is new? So not sure but Texas population does love Triathlon. I don’t think AC sells out but that’s a better question for the dashboard.
I started a thread on this & got some good feedback. @Robert Sabo said Atlantic City (AC) typically sells out mid-summer. @Scott Alexander thinks Waco will sell out (first year of event).
I think I'm going to book AC and go with that. I think the advantages of that outweigh the other plan. I like having "late season flexibility." I'll probably register within the next couple weeks to save $30.
https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/comment/257512#Comment_257512
My week 5 FTP test was a bit of a fail. I wasn't recovered enough. I had an ok 5 min VO2 test (significantly improved relative to the test 2 weeks prior with the incorrect crank arm setting): 328 Watts for 5 min. But I hit the wall between 10-15 minutes & bailed so I could recover. Based on the VO2 test, and the tests I did prior (with the incorrect crank arm settings), I've been working out as if my FTP is ~250 Watts and watching my HR, and it seems to be going well. If I can do 328 for 5 minutes, 250 Watts sounds like it *should* be conservative.
For the first ~5 weeks of OS, I was too stressed from work, not sleeping enough, and probably doing too many level 3 workouts, when combined with lifting, swimming and bike commuting. I pretty much never made it through a whole week without hitting the wall and having to bail on a workout.
But, this past week training went really well! I came off of a week of just running my 5k and bike commuting (because I had to focus all extra time on work for the week), and I tried to do more level 1 workouts to avoid burn out.
I've done 9 consecutive days of every workout on the scheduled day, and I've been able to hit goal Watts & HR really well at every workout. I honestly was going to cancel Sunday's long and just do a 5k w/ strides, because I wanted to swim a bit & get a big leg lift (pre-hab/re-hab/durability). But I was feeling good & got a whole Level 1 Sunday quality run in with solid Z4 intervals (Z4 HR with Z5+ pace (granted, only for 2*0.5 miles, on an indoor 200M track, but considering I didn't think I'd be up for any hard running, this was great news!). And I still felt pretty good today for a swim and my daily 5k.
Also good news: Late December to early April work should be less demanding, so I should be able to train really well. Mid April to late May will be more of a challenge.
Anyway, my most immediate question regarding my season: As we've discussed before, I'm going to Costa Rica to teach a class from 5/14-5/27 and my first A-race is CdA 70.3 on 6/24. As we discussed, I probably won't be able to bike much during those two weeks (and probably have reduced total training volume), but hopefully I will get some quality runs in and have my stretch cordz for swim simulation training. When I brought this up before, you weren't too worried about it.
Recently, Al Truscott said he had a spot open up for his AlT'tude camp starting 6/2. I'm super pumped because being a part of that that sounds awesome! Do you think it would be ok to head to that Al T'Tude camp after not biking much (or at all) from 5/14-5/27? I was thinking that would be an awesome volume pop during my last week of hard training before taper. It will probably be harder to get in swims and runs, but hopefully I can get them in.
Also, I noticed Cozumel 70.3 times were a lot less competitive in my AG than the Atlantic City times. I'm guessing part of that is the huge population density near A/C and the inconvenience of a destination race like Cozumel. But maybe it is the heat? They are only 1 week apart, so I was considering doing Cozumel instead of Atlantic City if it increased my chances of placing high (for more AWA points and a better chance of a World Championship slot). What do you think about doing Cozumel 70.3 instead of Atlantic City 70.3 because it seems less competitive?
THANKS!
Is this worth considering, or are those differences not that big of a deal? AC would be cheaper...
I'm SUPER excited about Al's camp, getting to train with a bunch of EN teammates in person and getting some epic bike rides in the mountains of CO!
I appreciate the advice on Cozumel. I was leaning that way, and your input really helps me feel confident about that decision.
Thanks!
When we discussed me doing that camp, were you assuming I would do the Snowmass Ragnar at the end?
I would LOVE to, but don't want to add too much stress to the system only ~2 weeks from my first A race on 6/24.
Looking at the calendar, the Ragnar is 6/8 & 6/9, and my first 70.3 is 6/24, so that gives me 15 full days to taper. That seems ok to me.
What do you think?
As of now, the group might not have slots for runners anyway (14 campers & 12 slots for runners). But some people may have to drop out.
I guess I could always camp out with everyone and run support for people actually running in the relay if there are no slots.
Thanks!
Remember, it’s always easy to do the work, but it’s definitely hard to stay sharp and get ready to race.
I'm making some slight edits to this 2:28 pm 1/23. ~15 hours after original post, so I'm hoping you didn't already read it.
First, RE, TSR: I forgot to include a gravel road bike race "Barry Roubaix" on 4/21. It has a fair bit of climbing (for MI) on rolling hills. They have 22, 36 & 62 mile races. I'm thinking the 36 would be best for me, since I'm focused on 70.3, and it will be on hilly gravel roads, so will take longer.
Second, In between OS & 70.3 program: I listened to the "rest of your season" 6 min audio w/ Coach Rich (~week 12 of OS). He said to plan to be in the 70.3 program for 8-10 weeks prior to your race. My first 70.3 is 6/24. So 10 weeks from that is 3/15.
- So, I have 10 weeks between the end of my OS & the "10 weeks" from my first 70.3 (20 weeks total).
- I'm guessing swim camp will be 2 weeks of that. I've been swimming a bit & hope to continue to build that. I'm mostly focusing on increasing stroke rate & drills to improve form & strength.
- Should I do 2 weeks of swim camp, 10 weeks of Get Faster & 8 weeks of 70.3 program pre-CdA 70.3 on 6/24? OR 2 weeks of swim camp, 8 weeks of Get Faster & 10 weeks of 70.3 program? Keep in mind I'll probably have a training drop during the last 2/4 high volume weeks prior to my race (2 weeks in Costa Rica, 1 week transition, 1 week of Al TTude camp, then 2 weeks of taper).
Third: I will go to Costa Rica 5/14-5/27 and then come back to do Al T-Tude camp on 6/2. I will have limited bike time in Costa Rica (and maybe limited training time overall). But i hope to keep running some (hopefully daily), doing core work and take my stretch cords for swim simulations. Should I go easy during the 5 days between Costa Rica and 6/2 snowmass camp, go medium, or go hard since my taper will be approaching quickly?Fourth: I want to go backpacking for a week or so after my 6/24 70.3 My next A race isn't until 8/12, so I figured that would be ok. Do you agree? I can run during that time too, just no biking.
Thanks!
Thanks for putting up with it. You aren't the first person to make a comment like that.
My old Zone 4 was 132-141
You told me last year that my run & bike HR zones should become closer over time, so I'm happy to see this! I never tested again all summer, so I don't know what the HR zones would have been in August at my peak, but I know that this is a sign of big progress since getting back on the bike in 11/1.
Here's your updated Season Plan, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This first post is my best outline of how to proceed with your races, but you can ask any / all questions you want. So post away, know that I reply here usually M/W/F each week.
Power User Tip: Click the Star icon by the Title of this thread to subscribe, and you'll get email updates when I do reply.
Your Notes
I've been keeping a 5k per day running streak for 83 days. I've been following the Nov OS pretty closely, with some deviations from work/travel/recovery/skiing. I've done more Level 1-2 workouts. Sometimes when I feel good, I do a Level 3 workout.
I did my first 70.3 in August, ran 2 marathons in 2017 (my first 2), and a 25k.
I did about 8 olympic tris in 2009-2010, but 2017 was my first year back to triathlon. I started swimming & biking (almost from scratch) in March 2017 on EN plans. I started running again seriously in July 2016.
Your Races
Season Update
These are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another one). You can change your plans on the Training Plan page by clicking the Move / Change button. Learn more about each plan on the Training Plan Central Page.
Coach Notes
Rob, the plan is up ^above^. I think I sorted through your request and all the notes we have here to complete the most recent list of events / dates / focus points. Since you have a long year, I don't want you to go nuts on the Half work in March with your last half in August. Too long! So we have Swim Camp and the Bike Focus block (prep you for Al Camp, you'll need to work in one long ride a week here on the weekends).
You'll have a few weeks to dial in your first half, then recover (a week!) and then back to a Half (through Great Lakes, etc).
Let's get to work!
~ Coach P
Sorry I mentioned a question related to this in another forum. I was being over-eager, and I figured I'd leverage the knowledge of the team while I waited for my TSR. Also, my bad for not requesting the TSR sooner.
I"m excited to stay in OS & keep getting faster! I'm glad I checked. Your TSR is definitely different than what I was imagining, so I'm really glad to have your guidance!
One question about the TSR posted above:
And the information I apparently left off my TSR:
- I am also doing Atlantic City 70.3 on 9/23/18
I agree it is a long season, and you warned me about this before. That is part of the reason we chose 9/23/18 70.3 instead of Waco 70.3 in late October. But I am going for an AWA status (hopefully silver or gold). So I need to do at least 3 events.One new question I have since submitting my TSR. Since I've been running everyday & enjoying the benefits, I'm eager to continue this running. I'm contemplating bringing my weekly running miles up to 39/week, which would get me close to 2018 miles in 2018 (I could easily make up the difference by adding in some running volume pops during IM build, and/or during post-season October-December 2018). My plan of attack would be to average 36 miles/week for the next couple weeks, and then to increase it to 39 miles/week (like the approach outlined in RDP info).
Relevant info:
- Would adding a goal of averaging 39 miles/week of running through to September be a bad idea, good idea, or neutral for my HIM performance? As recommended in "adding volume" guidelines from EN, I would add extra miles by running more time at TRP on "off days" and not make long runs longer than recommended during HIM plan and not extending Z3/4/5 time. I've been running 5k per day everyday for almost 100 days, so I could make that more like 4-5 base miles per day.
I've been using the star-power tip to get email updates on the most relevant threads for a while. Thanks a ton for making sure I knew about it!And thanks a million for your continued coaching, mentorship, guidance & inspiration!
I updated your Roadmap with AC, no worries...you were only throwing around 6 or 7 possible races. Nice to know even you are confused!
The Post Race Transition plan after CDA should only last a week before re-entering the final few weeks...that's why it says "Transition Early"
That's a lot of run miles just so you can have run miles.
I like you running but as we've seen with your foot, we all have limits. For a HIM season, 30 miles a week AVG is FANTASTIC...so stick with that as a baseline, with a bigger week every now and then. Once you are through AC we can do the math on the remainder and what you want to set.
Baby steps are super important here!
See you in Le Zwift soon enough...
~ Coach P
Regarding weekly mileage, that sounds smart. I did notice you said in your injury video that ~35 miles running per week is a limit for you, so that helped put things in perspective. Reminds me to #StayHumble and take baby steps.
Re: Post race transition, I"m not sure why I was confused about that before. I re-read your original comment and it is very clear now. I guess I was tired when I read it the first time..? Sorry about that!
Awesome, thanks! I'll keep shooting for ~30 running miles per week.
Yes, I'm trying to shift to being an earlier bird so it is easier to zwift with all of you! I got to bed 2 hours earlier than usual last night as a birthday present to myself!
Currently, as part of OS I'm doing 2.5-3.5 hour rides on Saturday's as part of the Saturday Long ride (the level 3 EN OS bike focus Saturday workout in Zwift is ~3hr20 min with all the warm up stuff: 12 min Z3 test & 30 min @ Z2). In the bike focus plan, the longest ride is 120 minutes on Sundays.
Does 120 minutes qualify as the "long ride" you reference in your comment? I'm assuming "long" is in the context of being prepared for the Al-T'Tude camp (I'm SO excited!). I imagine we'll get going on much longer rides during that week. So how long should my weekly "long ride" be during the bike focus block? Is 2.5-3.5 hours enough?
I assume this would best be done on Sundays as an extension of the 120 min Sunday ride already in the bike workout plan?
Another important question: I notice the swim camp comes right before the 6 week bike block. I also see the 6 week bike block does not have ANY swimming, and I exit that into my EN half plan. Shouldn't I do the 6 week bike block and THEN the swim camp? (Rather than swim focus for 2 weeks, and then not swim much for another 6 weeks). I read that swim camp is also about "resetting the legs," so I see the value in that.
I plan on maintaining some swimming throughout regardless. But it seems to make more sense to do the bike focus block & then swim camp before getting into EN half plan.
Thanks!
Personally, I would like to see you Do swim camp and recover from the outseason before you go to the rest of your year. Add Swims on Monday and Friday into the bike with this plan has it done and out season, and to be extended out Saturday ride to the 3 1/2 hour mark. What do you think?