@Brian Terwilliger Final surge is your membership plus $5. It's a value add to your membership. You didn't have it, now you do. It costs me $5 a month, so I am passing that on to everyone...this way I can still send my kids to college, etc. Otherwise I eat the cost of 500 folks at $60 a year. This is why you have the choice of opting in or not.
I can't just change your prices (Not how I roll), nor could I code it to change the old subscription to add Final Surge. So most folks have paid $5 a month...and some have rejoined. Totally up to you how you want to handle it and where your EN membership fits into your budget.
Happy to talk through this with you on the phone if you prefer. Note, it's the first price increase in EN membership since...well, you tell me. I certainly can't recall.
I am stunned. Absolutely stunned. Took off Sept, Oct, Nov, and Dec from the bike to Train for the Kiawah marathon. Got on the bike to ride the Tour de Zwift's 9 stages to reintroduce my butt and legs to the bike and ease back in. Didn't race them, did't really do much hard work. Just lots of steady riding, logging saddle time, and getting back in the groove.
Last night was the last stage of the tour and Out Season training starts in earnest next week for 13 weeks ending on May 5th with a non PR chasing half marathon. To hot and humid to seriously chase a sub 1:29 half at that race.
So, needing a base line to start bike training and set my zones, did an FTP test during the stage last night.
258! That is unreal. I was at @290 at the end of August going Into the White Lake Half Iron. I expected a much much larger drop in power. No doubt endurance has fallen way off. But to only lose around 30 watts with a 4 month layoff and only a handful of easyish rides to get back on bike is shocking.
So, realistically, what kind of target should I shoot for my number to be at the end of the Out Season?
And yesterday marked 135 consecutive days of running. Did an easy 2 miles before the bike to warm up. Mileage is way down from marathon training obviously. Only at 128 miles so far for January. But remaining consistent.
Now to lose the 10 pounds from my allowed December gluttony.
@Brian Terwilliger - Nice work my friend! I think there are two factors at play here.
First, we cannot underestimate your capacity for doing work and suffering. That scale is not discipline specific, then means you are ready for almost any physical challenge that would otherwise it seem daunting to others.
Second, while there isn’t a biomechanical crossover between running and cycling, there absolutely is an underlying fitness component that matters. Your run frequency has, and will continue to, pay massive dividends. On top of that we add the quality focused running you did for the marathon and it’s no surprise to me that the bike and numbers look good.
Second, while there isn’t a biomechanical crossover between running and cycling, there absolutely is an underlying fitness component that matters. Your run frequency has, and will continue to, pay massive dividends. On top of that we add the quality focused running you did for the marathon and it’s no surprise to me that the bike numbers look good.
The real question becomes, is it just your fitness that’s high and the bike legs have room to grow? Or are you showing up already with the level of fitness that will be hard to exceed? We won’t really know until we dive into the training.
I think you should absolutely target breaking the 300 barrier and put something on the table like 315. If anyone can do it, it is you. And I would be excited to see what you could do with the proper targets in place. The best part is, it’s not like you have to sit down now and do a crap ton of work to get going… You are already there!
315 is crazy in 13 weeks. I can see possibly eking out 300. I blipped out a 302 last out season and then immediately injured myself and pretty much turning the out season into a mess and months of recovery that took till late August to get back up to 290.
So if we can avoid injury and stick to plan, I'm pushing for the biggest number I can achieve. Haven't looked over the entire out season plan yet. Uploaded in in Final Surge and glanced. Will give it a good pouring over this weekend and see where I believe tweeks need to be made to better suit how my body responds to and absorbs work.
315-320 by IMMD race day at the end of Sept would make me very happy. Anything above that would a pleasant surprise. The gains will slow greatly or even plateau as the intensity is traded for endurance come June. But if we can get that number way up there above that, even better. My very poor math skills and understanding of bike power/splits/etc... has me believing I need to avg around 225 watts to safely break 5 hours for the IMMD bike. An FTP of 320 would realistically get me that number at proscribed IM bike intensity. So a bigger FTP and being able to ride even easier intensity at around 230 watts would probably make for a possible record breaking performance across the board. Just need to make sure I focus near equally on the run intensity and not just frequency. Going to take a real strong <3:30 run to put me where I want to be.
And I do love to suffer. I honestly love to suffer and destroy myself in training far more than I enjoy racing.
After months of suffering and whining about repeated 220 mile months for marathon training I was looking forward to the OS. I forgot how damn brutal the bike portion of it is. Geez.
With an FTP of 256 from the initial test, 2 x 15' at 250 on Tues and 2 x 18' at 240 on Thursday was pretty rough, but got through. The power is there, but the endurance needs work. Saturday's ride of 2.5 hours should be fun. 10' WU than 85' in Z3 capped off with 10' in Z4. Oh joy. Gonna put it in free ride mode for the 85' and just keep my watts up and do some attacks on climbs or chasing people around, then have it in ERG mode for the Z4 interval to force me to hold it. Or die trying.
And really enjoying running by power with Stryd instead of by pace. For me so far, I believe where it has benefitted me the most is by limiting my efforts. Particularly keeping things down around Z1/TRP on easier runs, on days I'm just logging some miles to keep the streak going (144 days last night), and on hills where I can let the pace climb and not worry about it. I have no doubt that it has allowed me to run more often, and more miles without imparting undue stress and fatigue by keeping efforts steady and at a lower energy expenditure.
A girl in my run club on Tuesday was inquiring on the clubs FB page about how can she learn to run "even pace splits" (miles) on her run. As we know, that is pretty difficult, particularly on varying terrain and slopes. Even a 2 or 3% incline can require a huge spike in power output to hold the pace from the flat leading into the hill. A higher %, forget it. My Wednesday runs are a 2.1 mile loop that is 1 mile down, and 1 mile up. And the OS run calls for 60 minutes at a smooth, steady TRP pace. EN Zone TRP is 258 for me. While Stryds Z1 zone goes to 258, so I don't mind bumping it a few watts when I'm doing TRP.
Where is this going? I did 8 miles in the hour (well, 1:03 or something). Throw out mile 1, down hill and easy warm up. Mile 2-8 all were within 3 watts of each other for the avg power. 263-266. But the pace varied from 7:47 to 8:30. So I posted the run to the club with the Stryd data in response to her request on even pacing. My miles were essentially perfectly even splits from a power stand point. But not so much on pace. And if I tried to hold a steady pace around 7:47 for the whole run (7:46 would be my EN TRP pace if running by pace), I'd of blown up and really struggled the last few miles. To go 7:47 on the mile climb, I would literally have to put out Z4 power.
Hopefully she and others will absorb the info and look into Stryd. I'm sold on the tool and hope others in the club get it. And to circle back, last year I'd of tried to at least push the pace on the climb to get it near TRP on a TRP run. Leaving me highly fatigued and probably struggling with the following bike and other training sessions. But keeping power in the proscribed window left me ready and able to crush it on Thursday.
Once it gets hot and humid out again down here in the South, I'm looking forward to trying out the running by power and using grade to force me to put out higher watts, vs having to run faster to get the watts. No way in hell I can be putting out 6:40 miles or faster when its 95 degrees out. But I bet I can (or at least come close) to holding the power range for such on a decent incline. So get the power expenditure benefit without having to risk a heart attack trying to run that damn fast in the heat.
I think the OS will make you For this first week, don't worry about also crushing the Weekend AND the Weekday. It could be something as simple as just doing what you can on the weekend...I'll take it.
The program is effective but can be a bit relentless as well; whatever mods you make, remember we want it to build over the course of the OS (aka not too much at the start).
I think you have a lot of potential on the bike based on (A) your current fitness, (B) your ability to do consistent work (C) your ability to suffer like nobody else. The key part will be to leave room for development if needed (easy on run for a week to push the bike for a week, for example). We can navigate that as it arises.
Also LOVE the idea of EVEN POWER SPLITS vs even time splits. I reserve the right to use that! You are way smarter than you look. 🤣
Still getting crushed by the OS bike workouts. But I'm crushing them right back. Hitting the numbers and not dying. FTP test coming up Week 5 on Tuesday. Let see if any gains have been made. Now to go drink beer and have fun at a board meeting for the new brewery.
Pffft. Paltry 6 watt gain. 258 to 264. Disappointing to say the least. But had no gas in the tank and really struggled out the gate. Even during the warm up high watt intervals I was struggling and knew I was in trouble. Wanted to quit half way thru the test, but not a piece of shit quitter so struggled on. Rough day I guess. Real life fatigue and the such. But gains are gains.
Hopefully I'm not at near peak shape. I see this as my last year to really attack and see large gains before the toll of older age starts to take hold as I turn 46 this summer. Maybe I'll move the next one to the Saturday of that week so I can get up and do it fresh in the morning instead of at the end of a work day. I don't know. Just disappointed and frustrated a little. I know I'm better and stronger than I was today for the test. And I don't like failing. Even though I added a few watts, I feel it was a failed test.
I'm making an executive decision and blowing off the run test tomorrow. Have a friend thats new to stryd and she has a half marathon on March 17th (I'll be pacing my 12 year old in it) so going to give her some legs to chase as she does her 3/9 test to set her power for the race. My zones wouldn't have improved enough to make a difference, if improved at all. Will do the test next time its scheduled and be fresh with moving the FTP test to Saturday that week.
And for the life of me I can not find the instructions on how to get the new power numbers to import into Final Surge. I know how to change my FTP and power zones in FS. But the process to get them to import the changes into the FS training plans is escaping all my searches. There was a way to do it without reloading a training plan. I found it an did it after the first FTP test, but can not locate it again. Or am I mis-remembering things here? Help me out here please.
On Edit: I think I figured out the FS zone update thingy by accident. Everything appears to have updated correctly.
As you get older, your capacity for work does feed… But the need for rest grows as well. Sometimes the hardest workout you do is the one that you don’t. I’m glad you found the instructions for the plants. You should always be able to find those at www.endurancenation.us/help
I will take 6 W for now. You had a big year last year with a fantastic ending. There is a material cost to that kind of work, so be patient.
Recovery is something I certainly need to improve upon. Sorta did that a little today. Forecast for the weekend was no rain today, rain tomorrow. So did tomorrows run today so I could be outside, but at a slower, steady pace for a little over 11 miles ( just over 90 minutes) vs the 80' run on plan with 25' of hard Z3 running. Lots of hills though so work was done. Will do todays bike tomorrow since it will be raining out. Yeah trainer rides for 2:30! LOL. I actually really enjoy it. Gonna hit the everything bagel so gotta put in some climbing. I do the 90' Z3 in free ride mode vs ERG like the rest of the workout. Lets me put in some good work chasing people, on some climbs, and small recoveries for eating and drinking or after a big attack. I think 90' at a set power in ERG would get a little mind numbing.
Well, recovery went out the window. My old neighbor who moved to Colorado started being a draft monkey on me shortly after the 90' in Z3 interval started. So I had to push it until he broke. And being in workout mode, I couldn't draft! Had to do all the hard work. Should have rode 215-220 watts. Avg 234 for the 90 minutes. But I felt great and really think I needed a ride like that. Been a while since I had to push for an extended period. And that damn Everything Bagel will make your butt push the watts. It may be worse than the ADZ when it comes to climbing.
With Zwift adding the Ramp Test, have a question. Since I believe I failed the previous FTP test, or at least it wasn't representative of what I believe my fitness level to be, would it be advisable to take the Ramp test this weekend for a comparison? This Saturdays ABP ride has 20' at 97% of FTP after the 90' in Z3. From what I understand about the ramp test from listening to Trainer Road podcasts for a long time, while its brutal, unlike the 20' test, its short and doesn't totally wipe you out and actually leaves enough gas in the tank to continue on with a workout afterward. So crazy idea is to warm up, do the ramp test (basically putting the 20' Z5 intervals at the start), then short recover, and carry on for 90' as best I am capable of in the targeted Z3 watt range. If the Ramp comes back in the same neighborhood as the FTP test from last week, then I know where I stand. If it comes back a bit higher, then I adjust the zones and my ability to do the work in the new zones will tell me if I am or am not actually at that level of fitness. If it comes back way out of line higher, than I toss it and see what happens at the next scheduled FTP test.
Yes, no, maybe? Thoughts?
On Edit: I'm gonna take my medicine and train at the level I earned with that FTP test and just be better prepared for the next one.
I think in the future the idea of doing that ramp test and then the rest of your workout is a good one. Just for the short term, you’ve been doing a fair amount of work and I know those results will come for you. No need to force them right now! I am glad to hear that you are at least open to the idea of some more recovery whether or not you actually take it! Situations like the one that arose with your body are 100% fine.
That’s why we train and have fitness! It’s more just making sure that not every session is an attempt to murder yourself. I think your work makes room for that type of recovery on an ad hoc basis, but there’s nothing wrong with being more prescriptive with it too.
Well, I'm still alive. Been hitting the workouts as best I can. Doing most of them as written for level 3 in the Bike Focus OS. But sometimes pressed for time and have to shorten them. Runs have been great. While not expecting a Half Marathon PR on May 5th because it will likely be a billion degrees and a trillion percent humidity, I do expect to have a good day.
This week (week 10) had Tues FTP test. I do think I'm far from optimal after a day of work and sitting at my desk so moved it to today so I could try it semi fresh. Did the Ramp test. Wow. Easy as can be and then BOOM, it crushes you and you're done. But, came in at 273. Up 9 watts. I'm too lazy to scroll up and look, but I think test 1 was 256. Test two was 264. And I knew there was no way I could do the full 2:30 ride after the test, or even the shortened 2 hour version for level 1. Time tight. But did an hour and pushed the watts, chased a couple sprints and hit the KOMs pretty strong. Ended up avg 243 for the hour. I'll take it after the test. And I honestly think I'm built for holding a good number over a long period of time, vs putting out a huge number for a short period of time. So can probably race at the upper end to slightly over the EN target for an IM.
I think 285 is a reasonable and reachable goal for FTP coming out of the OS. I knew your 300 target was a bit excessive. But I can see us getting well past that by race day end of Sept. Will be in the midst of stage one of a home renovation the last week of the OS. Great timing! So will push the final FTP test to Tuesday after the Sunday half. As part of the Reno, brought in an electrocution to rewire the garage. Added 10 outlets and putting in 4 TVs for Zwift and the treadmill.
So, power plan for the half. With expected weather being far from optimal, whats the EN way to adjust Stryd power for an open running race in heat? Stryd race calculator says 300-305 for a half marathon. I strongly suspect the is not possible. For reference/refresher, ran the Kiawah Marathon with a target of 285 and ended up avg 282. The half marathon is pancake flat. So run at Stryd suggested power or near it until HR hits what I know is my upper limit for being out there 1:30ish? Run at that power until I can't? Knock a certain % off and run at that? If its 90 with 90% humidity I think everything just goes out the window and it becomes a run of survival and not hurting oneself.
And in a couple weeks we will need to lay out the rest of the season to get to IMMD on Sept 28th ready to go well under 10. Based off doing Choo last time (same weekend), we started dedicated IM training on July 1.
I suspect we jump into Swim Camp right after the OS. I think for May I need a good volume pop, be it bike or run. Maybe Run. Have a 10K on a very hilly course June 1 that I want to crush. Could do the same in June as well but maybe a bike volume pop. And if memory serves, the new IM plans only have 2 swims a week. Thats not gonna cut it. I'm sure there is a supplement or something for those who need more swimming. I could easily do it and do it well on 2, but I like to train for the swim like its a straight up swim race so I can take it super easy on race day and come out of the water rested and ready to go while others are gassed.
First workout with the new power zones on the bike after Saturdays ramp test. Week 11 OS Bike Focused, Lvl 3. 2 x 20' (5') at 95% of FTP. FTP 273, so 260 for 20', twice. I've honestly been struggling on the bike for some reason, so picked the lower end of the provided range. Been hitting things as best I could. But not doing or feeling good on the bike or with my workouts. So when building it up in Zwift when I got home from work I was really tempted to drop down to lvl 1, only 12' at 260. But I told my self, Rule #5, HTFU! Champions don't do level 1. Suck it up, hit it hard and if you die you die, just hit the down button and drop the watts till the end of the interval.
Shockingly, even at the new higher zones I destroyed the workout and had tons of gas left in the tank after the 2nd interval and was sad to see it end. Took 11 weeks, but today was by far the best session I've had on the bike all OS. HR stayed well below where I thought it would be. Expected it to spike to the top end of Z5, but it didn't. Only touched Z5 at the end of the 2nd 20'. Hopefully a corner has been turned and we can really start popping some great workouts and jack up the FTP a few more watts before the OS ends.
Next week on Tuesday its 3 x 12' so I'll push it to the upper end of the target range and see what happens.
Podcast idea. Its something I've thought would be a great series of shows for some time.
Interview athletes before and after their IM then put em together into a single show. In the pre-race interview, discuss their training and their race plan. Then post race, discuss how the race went and how well they were able to stick to their plan and what changes they had to make and why. It would be interesting to hear how Plan vs Reality ended up either working or not working. A good mix of first timers, back of the packers, midpackers and the speed demon KQ racers would provide an awesome mix of experience, knowledge, and insight.
Thanks for keeping me updated. I like your idea of using the lower end of the power zones as a target. Remember, the fatigue you feel good before and starting a workout is not the same as you will feel in a work out. Don’t let that early mindset stop you from giving it a shot. I know that’s what you’re doing, but I just want to reassure you.
I do like the podcast idea I will put it into our content bucket. 👍
Something I have somewhat fretted over is how to adjust my run power zones as we get into the heat and humidity of summer. Stryd just released a conversation calculator for heat, humidity, and altitude. Played with it a little and it looks like a great tool. Should push it out to the team for us Stryd users to utilize over the summer and for making adjustments to training and race day power. I'll post it, but suggest you include it in one of the team emails so everyone sees it.
As a quick example, Stryd race power calculator has me run a half marathon at 305 watts. This seems almost doable. In the winter. But I know from years of running in the south, that is NOT possible for a summer race. So my idea in my head was to run at my marathon power (285) until I couldn't any more and adjust on the fly to survive. This seemed like a reasonable drop in power that I could sustain for 13 miles. With the new Stryd calculator, it told me to run at 279 based off a temp of 90 and humidity of 90. Will plug in actual expected conditions the night before and see what it says. But at 279, holding a 275 to 285 range seems perfect.
Now, a training and testing question for the summer months. Its clear I can put out the power and pace for my 3/9 test with Stryd currently. But quickly won't, at least for long periods of time due to conditions. Should I update my Stryd power data with the half marathon results? My reservations about doing so. It won't be a PR effort, or even close likely. I fear that this will give me power zones that are in reality too low. Currently, my TRP power is 258. And running below this power is difficult. Just moving my larger mass around requires near that power. So with the lower numbers from the what I expect my half to come in at, I worry that Z1, TRP, and Z2 will likely be undoable as they are too low from a sheer moving my 80kg body around. So Z3, 4, and 5 will be where I'd have to run proscribed TRP and Z2 runs. Should I just leave them where they are from the last 3/9 test and the shortly I the future do the 3/9 test again and reset zones from that? I suspect so.
Alright. Final FTP test of the OS was done tonight. 281. I'll take it. Test half marathon this Sunday. Sorta. Brutal conditions are forecast with high possibility of heavy rain. Just looking to do well and hit power targets and have a good day.
Need a plan going forward. I loaded up swim camp to start Monday. But I'll actually start on Tuesday probably. Will take the week to do some fun and social running, some Zwifting. Have my oldest's Eagle Scout project on Saturday the 11th. Mothers day Sunday. Monday the 13th I can kick into high gear.
IMMD on Sept. 28th. When I did Choo in Sept 2017 we started IM training on July 1. Same plan? Or start June 3rd? I have a 10K on June 1 I want to crush. So what should I do from May 13th to race day? What should I do for the month of June if not starting IM plan? I suspect a big volume pop of some sort. Or more short, hard, fast stuff?
And would the bike focus or run focus IM plan be better for me? I'm adding the swim supplement as well. Need the 3 days a week. Planning on also doing an OWS before the ABP ride a couple times a month as well. I'm a pool swimmer. More OWS will benefit me greatly. Though I have some friends that actually go and do OWS before dawn during the week. I'm not sure I am comfortable with that.
Tell me what to do boss man.
Today also marked 226 consecutive days of running. Avg 36 miles a week during OS. Plan is to run every day until IMMD.
And just throwing this out there. Brutal trail 50K on Oct 18th at Uwharrie National Forest. I like to do stupid stuff. 3 weeks after IM, why not? Right?
It’s really hard to do the modifications on a case-by-case basis for the summer, because different workouts will allow you to do different things. I am OK with you doing your normal Watts, a.k.a. winter Watts, for the shorter intervals as it anything under a mile. It’s the longer runs that we need to be mindful of because the cost will simply be physiologically to high.
So I see you keep the normal watts Inc the Calculator and then make adjustments on the longer ones either manually or just on a case-by-case basis according to the weather and that spreadsheet.
As for your current training program, you do have an open window of about five weeks where you could load the bike focus plan in there and add more volume on the weekends. It’s pretty adjustable and will get you to bridge between now and the regular season. Anyone of these weeks would also be a great opportunity to put in a lot of cycling volume if your schedule should allow. You don’t need to get serious with the actual IRONMAN plan until the middle of June! I still recommend the bike focus plan for you because I feel like your van is really solid right now.
Alright. Bike focus block advanced loaded up to end on June 23rd, starting May 13th. Will do my best to follow it. Probably will pretty closely for the bike, but will mix up the runs some. Will also swim through it as well. Will do a power test that last week.
That heat/humidity adjustment calculator from Stryd seems to be pretty spot on. Entered conditions morning of the race. The race calculator in the Stryd app told me to run a half marathon at 305 watts. The adjuster brought that down to 275. Results? Avg 276 and PR’d the race by 3:30 something over last year under more difficult conditions. Went 1:41 and change. Went just over 1:45 last year and was dying. Think I threw in the towel about mile 8 last year, or earlier. Had no need to throw in towel this year. Though, at mile 11, knowing I had a huge PR for the race in the bag, I did stop caring a little bit as that’s where you turned out of the sheltered neighborhoods and onto the open road along the ocean and it was the worst headwind I had ever ran into. And not chasing a PR for the distance, I didn’t feel a need to destroy myself for 2 miles for what? A 30 or 40 second faster time? If I could put out my 2 highest power miles for the day. So just held steady and smooth and finished very happy with my day.
I’m really looking forward to training with Stryd over the summer and seeing just how big of an IM marathon PR I can put up running by power.
Questions for the not so distant future.
1) July 26 – August 4th I am on vacation and will likely not have my bike and no swimming. So looking for a solid run block to sub in that week.
2) The IMMD bike course is pretty simple. Flat, nothing technical, no crazy climbs or descents. Straight forward flat double loop. The only X factor is the wind. Can be mild to wild. Would it be worth heading up there for 4 days (Aug 21-25) to ride the course 2 or 3 times, miss out on swimming, and have a much reduced run volume? I’m leaning toward no. But want your insight/advice.
3) IMMD Gearing. I have an 11-28 and an 11-25 rear cog depending on what wheels I have on the bike and could put either on the race wheel. As mentioned in my White Lake Half Iron race report last Sept, depending on the wind and or false flat (or both combined), I can run into a gap in gears where to hold my specified power I either have to spin too fast or have a cadence that is too low in a bigger gear, burning up my quads. Would an 11-23 solve this problem by giving me a tighter spread on the gears? And might I run into a problem where the 23 isn’t enough gear? I suspect it would have to be a pretty stiff headwind for it to be not enough gears. Which is a possibility at IMMD. And am I strong enough for an 11-23? My real problem is that it is way to damn hilly around here to experiment with an 11-23. The 11-25 really tests my limits on a lot of the climbs on my normal loops.
@Brian Terwilliger lol I see you more on STRYD FB group than here! I’m here but after a while you’ll need to bump it back up as the other threads roll in. My bad.
Yes to the run block that vacation week but will have to see how you’re feeling when I get there, but it’s a bit premature to make a recommendation in early June.
I agree, there is no need for you to go to Maryland to practice riding your bike out of the course courses are hard because of staying in the arrow position and lack of riding with your kids. So you will need to do a good job of holding your race power at different ranges of cadence: 85 RPMs 90 RPMs 95 RPM. You also need to plan to stand up every 30 minutes in a bigger gear just to stretch before you get back to work. Flexibility and core strength would be more important.
You are strong enough on the flats for an 11- 23 it would be sufficient, but tell me what you’re running on the front as that will determine the ratios. I’d like to do if having a tighter range for you but I also don’t want to make sure ability to spend at a higher cadence of acquired. If you go 11-23, I might have to get used to spending a little bit of time in your small ring as needed despite the fact that your ego will hate that.
Whatever hearing you decide on, you’re gonna have to spend the second half of August and it changed it again, it’s much more about what Kayden‘s team is staying in the aero bars, and cabs are natural and they shouldn’t be that bad on a 25. If it was me I would run a 25 but again, let me know what you have on the front.
And I was posting at a time when you had back to back to back camps and was traveling a lot. I figured it take a good while to get a response and then roll off if you didn't get to it.
OK, thanks for your update on the front rings. With a 5236 you are borderline for the 23. If your cadence is happy in that 85 average space, then the 23 will work. But honestly, going up to the 25 will only leave you with a slight gap and one that you could easily overcome if needed.
Rather than focus on your gearing as the mechanism for max speed, I would have a good look at your arrow position and your friend and set up to make sure that is bulletproof. How much more aero can that be? Are there changes you can make to your tire selection or tubes that will have an impact? There are other places to make up larger amounts of time, in other words.
No worries about the posting, I came off those camps right into a local political nightmare, and now I’m three days out from the charity ride I organize every year. Clearly I am a pathological busybody.
When you get a chance, how about you post a couple pictures of yourself from your last few races so we can see your set up and have a conversation about it.
Here is the best I can do for a photo of my setup. This is from the 2018 IM Raleigh 70.3. So 1 year ago near exactly. June 3, 2018. Nothing has changed on the bike. X-Lab Torpedo Versa 500 between the bars for hydration and computer mount. Have a dual cage X Lab behind the saddle. The bag I used for my repair kit items failed a good while back and I just never replaced it and use the X Lab bottle thingy to put my tubes, tools, co2, etc… in there. Thus a bottle on the down tube. I should probably get rid of that and get another bag for my repair items. I carry all my own nutrition on the bike. But launched and lost a bottle prior to this photo, thus the gatorade from an aid station on the down tube. I use Infinit Go Far with base salt added to get the sodium up. Have a few GU/Honey Stinger in the bento box. Will slam a few of those down in the last hour to get a nice calorie boost leading into the run. All the races I’ve done since then are local races that don’t really have photographers and race photos. Maybe a couple on the run, but thats about it.
I’d like to get my cockpit down a little bit lower. But I am really really comfortable. And there is something to say for comfort over 112 miles. I never have to come out of aero unless conditions dictate I do for safety reasons. Is it worth possibly losing comfort to gain what is likely marginal aero points? Don’t know. The other issue is the bolts that hold the thing together are seized up thanks to sweat and drink and getting them out and replaced will cost a fortune. Not sure its worth the expenditure. Who knows.
On cadence, I prefer 90. Its my default number without even thinking about it. Its not uncommon for me to have to force myself down to 90. For IM Choo, even with all the climbing, and the coasting on some of the downs, my avg cadence came in at 88 if memory serves me right. I didn’t have a power meter or cadence sensor on the bike when I did Maryland in 2015 so the only stat I have from that is how long it took.
Wheels are Flo 60/90 with the wheel builder aero jacket. Tires are the GP 4000 II or whatever its called. I don't see the benefit in paying near $100 a tire for the GP 5000. I run regular butyl tubes. I'm a little scared of latex ones and flatting. Piece of mind is worth something.
The biggest change I see for you is figuring out your elbow position under your shoulders. It’s possible that you just have really long legs but when I look at this picture your body angles are good but for my comfort perspective that’s not very relaxed. The two options are to either move the seat forward, or shorten the stem a bit to bring the elbows back. Head over to TtBikeFit to see some examples.
I would be mildly concerned about your cockpit if the bolts are all seized up. Depending on how long they have been that way it’s possible they may not be very resilient at this point. Something to think about.
The only other change I would make to your set up is going with wider tires. Something like 25s would allow you to run the middle lower pressure and get a few more watts out of your current set up and make the ride more comfortable.
My elbows/arms start in the position you drew, but work their way foward over time sliding from sweat. Then I move em back. Wash, rinse, repeat. I have a history of shoulder injuries from a lifetime of swimming and surgery to try and fix the left one. Was supposed to do the right as well, but the recovery was so bad I decided to not do it. Often I find the pressure on the shoulders when properly propped up on the elbows leads to shoulder pain so I don't mind when they slide forward a bit.
Comments
@Brian Terwilliger Final surge is your membership plus $5. It's a value add to your membership. You didn't have it, now you do. It costs me $5 a month, so I am passing that on to everyone...this way I can still send my kids to college, etc. Otherwise I eat the cost of 500 folks at $60 a year. This is why you have the choice of opting in or not.
I can't just change your prices (Not how I roll), nor could I code it to change the old subscription to add Final Surge. So most folks have paid $5 a month...and some have rejoined. Totally up to you how you want to handle it and where your EN membership fits into your budget.
Happy to talk through this with you on the phone if you prefer. Note, it's the first price increase in EN membership since...well, you tell me. I certainly can't recall.
~ Coach P
@Coach Patrick
I am stunned. Absolutely stunned. Took off Sept, Oct, Nov, and Dec from the bike to Train for the Kiawah marathon. Got on the bike to ride the Tour de Zwift's 9 stages to reintroduce my butt and legs to the bike and ease back in. Didn't race them, did't really do much hard work. Just lots of steady riding, logging saddle time, and getting back in the groove.
Last night was the last stage of the tour and Out Season training starts in earnest next week for 13 weeks ending on May 5th with a non PR chasing half marathon. To hot and humid to seriously chase a sub 1:29 half at that race.
So, needing a base line to start bike training and set my zones, did an FTP test during the stage last night.
258! That is unreal. I was at @290 at the end of August going Into the White Lake Half Iron. I expected a much much larger drop in power. No doubt endurance has fallen way off. But to only lose around 30 watts with a 4 month layoff and only a handful of easyish rides to get back on bike is shocking.
So, realistically, what kind of target should I shoot for my number to be at the end of the Out Season?
And yesterday marked 135 consecutive days of running. Did an easy 2 miles before the bike to warm up. Mileage is way down from marathon training obviously. Only at 128 miles so far for January. But remaining consistent.
Now to lose the 10 pounds from my allowed December gluttony.
@Brian Terwilliger - Nice work my friend! I think there are two factors at play here.
First, we cannot underestimate your capacity for doing work and suffering. That scale is not discipline specific, then means you are ready for almost any physical challenge that would otherwise it seem daunting to others.
Second, while there isn’t a biomechanical crossover between running and cycling, there absolutely is an underlying fitness component that matters. Your run frequency has, and will continue to, pay massive dividends. On top of that we add the quality focused running you did for the marathon and it’s no surprise to me that the bike and numbers look good.
Second, while there isn’t a biomechanical crossover between running and cycling, there absolutely is an underlying fitness component that matters. Your run frequency has, and will continue to, pay massive dividends. On top of that we add the quality focused running you did for the marathon and it’s no surprise to me that the bike numbers look good.
The real question becomes, is it just your fitness that’s high and the bike legs have room to grow? Or are you showing up already with the level of fitness that will be hard to exceed? We won’t really know until we dive into the training.
I think you should absolutely target breaking the 300 barrier and put something on the table like 315. If anyone can do it, it is you. And I would be excited to see what you could do with the proper targets in place. The best part is, it’s not like you have to sit down now and do a crap ton of work to get going… You are already there!
315 is crazy in 13 weeks. I can see possibly eking out 300. I blipped out a 302 last out season and then immediately injured myself and pretty much turning the out season into a mess and months of recovery that took till late August to get back up to 290.
So if we can avoid injury and stick to plan, I'm pushing for the biggest number I can achieve. Haven't looked over the entire out season plan yet. Uploaded in in Final Surge and glanced. Will give it a good pouring over this weekend and see where I believe tweeks need to be made to better suit how my body responds to and absorbs work.
315-320 by IMMD race day at the end of Sept would make me very happy. Anything above that would a pleasant surprise. The gains will slow greatly or even plateau as the intensity is traded for endurance come June. But if we can get that number way up there above that, even better. My very poor math skills and understanding of bike power/splits/etc... has me believing I need to avg around 225 watts to safely break 5 hours for the IMMD bike. An FTP of 320 would realistically get me that number at proscribed IM bike intensity. So a bigger FTP and being able to ride even easier intensity at around 230 watts would probably make for a possible record breaking performance across the board. Just need to make sure I focus near equally on the run intensity and not just frequency. Going to take a real strong <3:30 run to put me where I want to be.
And I do love to suffer. I honestly love to suffer and destroy myself in training far more than I enjoy racing.
After months of suffering and whining about repeated 220 mile months for marathon training I was looking forward to the OS. I forgot how damn brutal the bike portion of it is. Geez.
With an FTP of 256 from the initial test, 2 x 15' at 250 on Tues and 2 x 18' at 240 on Thursday was pretty rough, but got through. The power is there, but the endurance needs work. Saturday's ride of 2.5 hours should be fun. 10' WU than 85' in Z3 capped off with 10' in Z4. Oh joy. Gonna put it in free ride mode for the 85' and just keep my watts up and do some attacks on climbs or chasing people around, then have it in ERG mode for the Z4 interval to force me to hold it. Or die trying.
And really enjoying running by power with Stryd instead of by pace. For me so far, I believe where it has benefitted me the most is by limiting my efforts. Particularly keeping things down around Z1/TRP on easier runs, on days I'm just logging some miles to keep the streak going (144 days last night), and on hills where I can let the pace climb and not worry about it. I have no doubt that it has allowed me to run more often, and more miles without imparting undue stress and fatigue by keeping efforts steady and at a lower energy expenditure.
A girl in my run club on Tuesday was inquiring on the clubs FB page about how can she learn to run "even pace splits" (miles) on her run. As we know, that is pretty difficult, particularly on varying terrain and slopes. Even a 2 or 3% incline can require a huge spike in power output to hold the pace from the flat leading into the hill. A higher %, forget it. My Wednesday runs are a 2.1 mile loop that is 1 mile down, and 1 mile up. And the OS run calls for 60 minutes at a smooth, steady TRP pace. EN Zone TRP is 258 for me. While Stryds Z1 zone goes to 258, so I don't mind bumping it a few watts when I'm doing TRP.
Where is this going? I did 8 miles in the hour (well, 1:03 or something). Throw out mile 1, down hill and easy warm up. Mile 2-8 all were within 3 watts of each other for the avg power. 263-266. But the pace varied from 7:47 to 8:30. So I posted the run to the club with the Stryd data in response to her request on even pacing. My miles were essentially perfectly even splits from a power stand point. But not so much on pace. And if I tried to hold a steady pace around 7:47 for the whole run (7:46 would be my EN TRP pace if running by pace), I'd of blown up and really struggled the last few miles. To go 7:47 on the mile climb, I would literally have to put out Z4 power.
Hopefully she and others will absorb the info and look into Stryd. I'm sold on the tool and hope others in the club get it. And to circle back, last year I'd of tried to at least push the pace on the climb to get it near TRP on a TRP run. Leaving me highly fatigued and probably struggling with the following bike and other training sessions. But keeping power in the proscribed window left me ready and able to crush it on Thursday.
Once it gets hot and humid out again down here in the South, I'm looking forward to trying out the running by power and using grade to force me to put out higher watts, vs having to run faster to get the watts. No way in hell I can be putting out 6:40 miles or faster when its 95 degrees out. But I bet I can (or at least come close) to holding the power range for such on a decent incline. So get the power expenditure benefit without having to risk a heart attack trying to run that damn fast in the heat.
I think the OS will make you For this first week, don't worry about also crushing the Weekend AND the Weekday. It could be something as simple as just doing what you can on the weekend...I'll take it.
The program is effective but can be a bit relentless as well; whatever mods you make, remember we want it to build over the course of the OS (aka not too much at the start).
I think you have a lot of potential on the bike based on (A) your current fitness, (B) your ability to do consistent work (C) your ability to suffer like nobody else. The key part will be to leave room for development if needed (easy on run for a week to push the bike for a week, for example). We can navigate that as it arises.
Also LOVE the idea of EVEN POWER SPLITS vs even time splits. I reserve the right to use that! You are way smarter than you look. 🤣
@Coach Patrick
Still getting crushed by the OS bike workouts. But I'm crushing them right back. Hitting the numbers and not dying. FTP test coming up Week 5 on Tuesday. Let see if any gains have been made. Now to go drink beer and have fun at a board meeting for the new brewery.
@Coach Patrick
Pffft. Paltry 6 watt gain. 258 to 264. Disappointing to say the least. But had no gas in the tank and really struggled out the gate. Even during the warm up high watt intervals I was struggling and knew I was in trouble. Wanted to quit half way thru the test, but not a piece of shit quitter so struggled on. Rough day I guess. Real life fatigue and the such. But gains are gains.
Hopefully I'm not at near peak shape. I see this as my last year to really attack and see large gains before the toll of older age starts to take hold as I turn 46 this summer. Maybe I'll move the next one to the Saturday of that week so I can get up and do it fresh in the morning instead of at the end of a work day. I don't know. Just disappointed and frustrated a little. I know I'm better and stronger than I was today for the test. And I don't like failing. Even though I added a few watts, I feel it was a failed test.
I'm making an executive decision and blowing off the run test tomorrow. Have a friend thats new to stryd and she has a half marathon on March 17th (I'll be pacing my 12 year old in it) so going to give her some legs to chase as she does her 3/9 test to set her power for the race. My zones wouldn't have improved enough to make a difference, if improved at all. Will do the test next time its scheduled and be fresh with moving the FTP test to Saturday that week.
And for the life of me I can not find the instructions on how to get the new power numbers to import into Final Surge. I know how to change my FTP and power zones in FS. But the process to get them to import the changes into the FS training plans is escaping all my searches. There was a way to do it without reloading a training plan. I found it an did it after the first FTP test, but can not locate it again. Or am I mis-remembering things here? Help me out here please.
On Edit: I think I figured out the FS zone update thingy by accident. Everything appears to have updated correctly.
As you get older, your capacity for work does feed… But the need for rest grows as well. Sometimes the hardest workout you do is the one that you don’t. I’m glad you found the instructions for the plants. You should always be able to find those at www.endurancenation.us/help
I will take 6 W for now. You had a big year last year with a fantastic ending. There is a material cost to that kind of work, so be patient.
@Coach Patrick
Recovery is something I certainly need to improve upon. Sorta did that a little today. Forecast for the weekend was no rain today, rain tomorrow. So did tomorrows run today so I could be outside, but at a slower, steady pace for a little over 11 miles ( just over 90 minutes) vs the 80' run on plan with 25' of hard Z3 running. Lots of hills though so work was done. Will do todays bike tomorrow since it will be raining out. Yeah trainer rides for 2:30! LOL. I actually really enjoy it. Gonna hit the everything bagel so gotta put in some climbing. I do the 90' Z3 in free ride mode vs ERG like the rest of the workout. Lets me put in some good work chasing people, on some climbs, and small recoveries for eating and drinking or after a big attack. I think 90' at a set power in ERG would get a little mind numbing.
Well, recovery went out the window. My old neighbor who moved to Colorado started being a draft monkey on me shortly after the 90' in Z3 interval started. So I had to push it until he broke. And being in workout mode, I couldn't draft! Had to do all the hard work. Should have rode 215-220 watts. Avg 234 for the 90 minutes. But I felt great and really think I needed a ride like that. Been a while since I had to push for an extended period. And that damn Everything Bagel will make your butt push the watts. It may be worse than the ADZ when it comes to climbing.
With Zwift adding the Ramp Test, have a question. Since I believe I failed the previous FTP test, or at least it wasn't representative of what I believe my fitness level to be, would it be advisable to take the Ramp test this weekend for a comparison? This Saturdays ABP ride has 20' at 97% of FTP after the 90' in Z3. From what I understand about the ramp test from listening to Trainer Road podcasts for a long time, while its brutal, unlike the 20' test, its short and doesn't totally wipe you out and actually leaves enough gas in the tank to continue on with a workout afterward. So crazy idea is to warm up, do the ramp test (basically putting the 20' Z5 intervals at the start), then short recover, and carry on for 90' as best I am capable of in the targeted Z3 watt range. If the Ramp comes back in the same neighborhood as the FTP test from last week, then I know where I stand. If it comes back a bit higher, then I adjust the zones and my ability to do the work in the new zones will tell me if I am or am not actually at that level of fitness. If it comes back way out of line higher, than I toss it and see what happens at the next scheduled FTP test.
Yes, no, maybe? Thoughts?
On Edit: I'm gonna take my medicine and train at the level I earned with that FTP test and just be better prepared for the next one.
I think in the future the idea of doing that ramp test and then the rest of your workout is a good one. Just for the short term, you’ve been doing a fair amount of work and I know those results will come for you. No need to force them right now! I am glad to hear that you are at least open to the idea of some more recovery whether or not you actually take it! Situations like the one that arose with your body are 100% fine.
That’s why we train and have fitness! It’s more just making sure that not every session is an attempt to murder yourself. I think your work makes room for that type of recovery on an ad hoc basis, but there’s nothing wrong with being more prescriptive with it too.
@Coach Patrick
Well, I'm still alive. Been hitting the workouts as best I can. Doing most of them as written for level 3 in the Bike Focus OS. But sometimes pressed for time and have to shorten them. Runs have been great. While not expecting a Half Marathon PR on May 5th because it will likely be a billion degrees and a trillion percent humidity, I do expect to have a good day.
This week (week 10) had Tues FTP test. I do think I'm far from optimal after a day of work and sitting at my desk so moved it to today so I could try it semi fresh. Did the Ramp test. Wow. Easy as can be and then BOOM, it crushes you and you're done. But, came in at 273. Up 9 watts. I'm too lazy to scroll up and look, but I think test 1 was 256. Test two was 264. And I knew there was no way I could do the full 2:30 ride after the test, or even the shortened 2 hour version for level 1. Time tight. But did an hour and pushed the watts, chased a couple sprints and hit the KOMs pretty strong. Ended up avg 243 for the hour. I'll take it after the test. And I honestly think I'm built for holding a good number over a long period of time, vs putting out a huge number for a short period of time. So can probably race at the upper end to slightly over the EN target for an IM.
I think 285 is a reasonable and reachable goal for FTP coming out of the OS. I knew your 300 target was a bit excessive. But I can see us getting well past that by race day end of Sept. Will be in the midst of stage one of a home renovation the last week of the OS. Great timing! So will push the final FTP test to Tuesday after the Sunday half. As part of the Reno, brought in an electrocution to rewire the garage. Added 10 outlets and putting in 4 TVs for Zwift and the treadmill.
So, power plan for the half. With expected weather being far from optimal, whats the EN way to adjust Stryd power for an open running race in heat? Stryd race calculator says 300-305 for a half marathon. I strongly suspect the is not possible. For reference/refresher, ran the Kiawah Marathon with a target of 285 and ended up avg 282. The half marathon is pancake flat. So run at Stryd suggested power or near it until HR hits what I know is my upper limit for being out there 1:30ish? Run at that power until I can't? Knock a certain % off and run at that? If its 90 with 90% humidity I think everything just goes out the window and it becomes a run of survival and not hurting oneself.
And in a couple weeks we will need to lay out the rest of the season to get to IMMD on Sept 28th ready to go well under 10. Based off doing Choo last time (same weekend), we started dedicated IM training on July 1.
I suspect we jump into Swim Camp right after the OS. I think for May I need a good volume pop, be it bike or run. Maybe Run. Have a 10K on a very hilly course June 1 that I want to crush. Could do the same in June as well but maybe a bike volume pop. And if memory serves, the new IM plans only have 2 swims a week. Thats not gonna cut it. I'm sure there is a supplement or something for those who need more swimming. I could easily do it and do it well on 2, but I like to train for the swim like its a straight up swim race so I can take it super easy on race day and come out of the water rested and ready to go while others are gassed.
@Coach Patrick
First workout with the new power zones on the bike after Saturdays ramp test. Week 11 OS Bike Focused, Lvl 3. 2 x 20' (5') at 95% of FTP. FTP 273, so 260 for 20', twice. I've honestly been struggling on the bike for some reason, so picked the lower end of the provided range. Been hitting things as best I could. But not doing or feeling good on the bike or with my workouts. So when building it up in Zwift when I got home from work I was really tempted to drop down to lvl 1, only 12' at 260. But I told my self, Rule #5, HTFU! Champions don't do level 1. Suck it up, hit it hard and if you die you die, just hit the down button and drop the watts till the end of the interval.
Shockingly, even at the new higher zones I destroyed the workout and had tons of gas left in the tank after the 2nd interval and was sad to see it end. Took 11 weeks, but today was by far the best session I've had on the bike all OS. HR stayed well below where I thought it would be. Expected it to spike to the top end of Z5, but it didn't. Only touched Z5 at the end of the 2nd 20'. Hopefully a corner has been turned and we can really start popping some great workouts and jack up the FTP a few more watts before the OS ends.
Next week on Tuesday its 3 x 12' so I'll push it to the upper end of the target range and see what happens.
Podcast idea. Its something I've thought would be a great series of shows for some time.
Interview athletes before and after their IM then put em together into a single show. In the pre-race interview, discuss their training and their race plan. Then post race, discuss how the race went and how well they were able to stick to their plan and what changes they had to make and why. It would be interesting to hear how Plan vs Reality ended up either working or not working. A good mix of first timers, back of the packers, midpackers and the speed demon KQ racers would provide an awesome mix of experience, knowledge, and insight.
Thanks for keeping me updated. I like your idea of using the lower end of the power zones as a target. Remember, the fatigue you feel good before and starting a workout is not the same as you will feel in a work out. Don’t let that early mindset stop you from giving it a shot. I know that’s what you’re doing, but I just want to reassure you.
I do like the podcast idea I will put it into our content bucket. 👍
@Coach Patrick
Something I have somewhat fretted over is how to adjust my run power zones as we get into the heat and humidity of summer. Stryd just released a conversation calculator for heat, humidity, and altitude. Played with it a little and it looks like a great tool. Should push it out to the team for us Stryd users to utilize over the summer and for making adjustments to training and race day power. I'll post it, but suggest you include it in one of the team emails so everyone sees it.
As a quick example, Stryd race power calculator has me run a half marathon at 305 watts. This seems almost doable. In the winter. But I know from years of running in the south, that is NOT possible for a summer race. So my idea in my head was to run at my marathon power (285) until I couldn't any more and adjust on the fly to survive. This seemed like a reasonable drop in power that I could sustain for 13 miles. With the new Stryd calculator, it told me to run at 279 based off a temp of 90 and humidity of 90. Will plug in actual expected conditions the night before and see what it says. But at 279, holding a 275 to 285 range seems perfect.
Now, a training and testing question for the summer months. Its clear I can put out the power and pace for my 3/9 test with Stryd currently. But quickly won't, at least for long periods of time due to conditions. Should I update my Stryd power data with the half marathon results? My reservations about doing so. It won't be a PR effort, or even close likely. I fear that this will give me power zones that are in reality too low. Currently, my TRP power is 258. And running below this power is difficult. Just moving my larger mass around requires near that power. So with the lower numbers from the what I expect my half to come in at, I worry that Z1, TRP, and Z2 will likely be undoable as they are too low from a sheer moving my 80kg body around. So Z3, 4, and 5 will be where I'd have to run proscribed TRP and Z2 runs. Should I just leave them where they are from the last 3/9 test and the shortly I the future do the 3/9 test again and reset zones from that? I suspect so.
@Coach Patrick
Alright. Final FTP test of the OS was done tonight. 281. I'll take it. Test half marathon this Sunday. Sorta. Brutal conditions are forecast with high possibility of heavy rain. Just looking to do well and hit power targets and have a good day.
Need a plan going forward. I loaded up swim camp to start Monday. But I'll actually start on Tuesday probably. Will take the week to do some fun and social running, some Zwifting. Have my oldest's Eagle Scout project on Saturday the 11th. Mothers day Sunday. Monday the 13th I can kick into high gear.
IMMD on Sept. 28th. When I did Choo in Sept 2017 we started IM training on July 1. Same plan? Or start June 3rd? I have a 10K on June 1 I want to crush. So what should I do from May 13th to race day? What should I do for the month of June if not starting IM plan? I suspect a big volume pop of some sort. Or more short, hard, fast stuff?
And would the bike focus or run focus IM plan be better for me? I'm adding the swim supplement as well. Need the 3 days a week. Planning on also doing an OWS before the ABP ride a couple times a month as well. I'm a pool swimmer. More OWS will benefit me greatly. Though I have some friends that actually go and do OWS before dawn during the week. I'm not sure I am comfortable with that.
Tell me what to do boss man.
Today also marked 226 consecutive days of running. Avg 36 miles a week during OS. Plan is to run every day until IMMD.
And just throwing this out there. Brutal trail 50K on Oct 18th at Uwharrie National Forest. I like to do stupid stuff. 3 weeks after IM, why not? Right?
It’s really hard to do the modifications on a case-by-case basis for the summer, because different workouts will allow you to do different things. I am OK with you doing your normal Watts, a.k.a. winter Watts, for the shorter intervals as it anything under a mile. It’s the longer runs that we need to be mindful of because the cost will simply be physiologically to high.
So I see you keep the normal watts Inc the Calculator and then make adjustments on the longer ones either manually or just on a case-by-case basis according to the weather and that spreadsheet.
As for your current training program, you do have an open window of about five weeks where you could load the bike focus plan in there and add more volume on the weekends. It’s pretty adjustable and will get you to bridge between now and the regular season. Anyone of these weeks would also be a great opportunity to put in a lot of cycling volume if your schedule should allow. You don’t need to get serious with the actual IRONMAN plan until the middle of June! I still recommend the bike focus plan for you because I feel like your van is really solid right now.
@Coach Patrick
Alright. Bike focus block advanced loaded up to end on June 23rd, starting May 13th. Will do my best to follow it. Probably will pretty closely for the bike, but will mix up the runs some. Will also swim through it as well. Will do a power test that last week.
That heat/humidity adjustment calculator from Stryd seems to be pretty spot on. Entered conditions morning of the race. The race calculator in the Stryd app told me to run a half marathon at 305 watts. The adjuster brought that down to 275. Results? Avg 276 and PR’d the race by 3:30 something over last year under more difficult conditions. Went 1:41 and change. Went just over 1:45 last year and was dying. Think I threw in the towel about mile 8 last year, or earlier. Had no need to throw in towel this year. Though, at mile 11, knowing I had a huge PR for the race in the bag, I did stop caring a little bit as that’s where you turned out of the sheltered neighborhoods and onto the open road along the ocean and it was the worst headwind I had ever ran into. And not chasing a PR for the distance, I didn’t feel a need to destroy myself for 2 miles for what? A 30 or 40 second faster time? If I could put out my 2 highest power miles for the day. So just held steady and smooth and finished very happy with my day.
I’m really looking forward to training with Stryd over the summer and seeing just how big of an IM marathon PR I can put up running by power.
Questions for the not so distant future.
1) July 26 – August 4th I am on vacation and will likely not have my bike and no swimming. So looking for a solid run block to sub in that week.
2) The IMMD bike course is pretty simple. Flat, nothing technical, no crazy climbs or descents. Straight forward flat double loop. The only X factor is the wind. Can be mild to wild. Would it be worth heading up there for 4 days (Aug 21-25) to ride the course 2 or 3 times, miss out on swimming, and have a much reduced run volume? I’m leaning toward no. But want your insight/advice.
3) IMMD Gearing. I have an 11-28 and an 11-25 rear cog depending on what wheels I have on the bike and could put either on the race wheel. As mentioned in my White Lake Half Iron race report last Sept, depending on the wind and or false flat (or both combined), I can run into a gap in gears where to hold my specified power I either have to spin too fast or have a cadence that is too low in a bigger gear, burning up my quads. Would an 11-23 solve this problem by giving me a tighter spread on the gears? And might I run into a problem where the 23 isn’t enough gear? I suspect it would have to be a pretty stiff headwind for it to be not enough gears. Which is a possibility at IMMD. And am I strong enough for an 11-23? My real problem is that it is way to damn hilly around here to experiment with an 11-23. The 11-25 really tests my limits on a lot of the climbs on my normal loops.
Hello, is this thing on?
@Brian Terwilliger lol I see you more on STRYD FB group than here! I’m here but after a while you’ll need to bump it back up as the other threads roll in. My bad.
Yes to the run block that vacation week but will have to see how you’re feeling when I get there, but it’s a bit premature to make a recommendation in early June.
I agree, there is no need for you to go to Maryland to practice riding your bike out of the course courses are hard because of staying in the arrow position and lack of riding with your kids. So you will need to do a good job of holding your race power at different ranges of cadence: 85 RPMs 90 RPMs 95 RPM. You also need to plan to stand up every 30 minutes in a bigger gear just to stretch before you get back to work. Flexibility and core strength would be more important.
You are strong enough on the flats for an 11- 23 it would be sufficient, but tell me what you’re running on the front as that will determine the ratios. I’d like to do if having a tighter range for you but I also don’t want to make sure ability to spend at a higher cadence of acquired. If you go 11-23, I might have to get used to spending a little bit of time in your small ring as needed despite the fact that your ego will hate that.
Whatever hearing you decide on, you’re gonna have to spend the second half of August and it changed it again, it’s much more about what Kayden‘s team is staying in the aero bars, and cabs are natural and they shouldn’t be that bad on a 25. If it was me I would run a 25 but again, let me know what you have on the front.
I run Rotor Q-Rings on the front, 52/36
And I was posting at a time when you had back to back to back camps and was traveling a lot. I figured it take a good while to get a response and then roll off if you didn't get to it.
OK, thanks for your update on the front rings. With a 5236 you are borderline for the 23. If your cadence is happy in that 85 average space, then the 23 will work. But honestly, going up to the 25 will only leave you with a slight gap and one that you could easily overcome if needed.
Rather than focus on your gearing as the mechanism for max speed, I would have a good look at your arrow position and your friend and set up to make sure that is bulletproof. How much more aero can that be? Are there changes you can make to your tire selection or tubes that will have an impact? There are other places to make up larger amounts of time, in other words.
No worries about the posting, I came off those camps right into a local political nightmare, and now I’m three days out from the charity ride I organize every year. Clearly I am a pathological busybody.
When you get a chance, how about you post a couple pictures of yourself from your last few races so we can see your set up and have a conversation about it.
@Coach Patrick
Here is the best I can do for a photo of my setup. This is from the 2018 IM Raleigh 70.3. So 1 year ago near exactly. June 3, 2018. Nothing has changed on the bike. X-Lab Torpedo Versa 500 between the bars for hydration and computer mount. Have a dual cage X Lab behind the saddle. The bag I used for my repair kit items failed a good while back and I just never replaced it and use the X Lab bottle thingy to put my tubes, tools, co2, etc… in there. Thus a bottle on the down tube. I should probably get rid of that and get another bag for my repair items. I carry all my own nutrition on the bike. But launched and lost a bottle prior to this photo, thus the gatorade from an aid station on the down tube. I use Infinit Go Far with base salt added to get the sodium up. Have a few GU/Honey Stinger in the bento box. Will slam a few of those down in the last hour to get a nice calorie boost leading into the run. All the races I’ve done since then are local races that don’t really have photographers and race photos. Maybe a couple on the run, but thats about it.
I’d like to get my cockpit down a little bit lower. But I am really really comfortable. And there is something to say for comfort over 112 miles. I never have to come out of aero unless conditions dictate I do for safety reasons. Is it worth possibly losing comfort to gain what is likely marginal aero points? Don’t know. The other issue is the bolts that hold the thing together are seized up thanks to sweat and drink and getting them out and replaced will cost a fortune. Not sure its worth the expenditure. Who knows.
On cadence, I prefer 90. Its my default number without even thinking about it. Its not uncommon for me to have to force myself down to 90. For IM Choo, even with all the climbing, and the coasting on some of the downs, my avg cadence came in at 88 if memory serves me right. I didn’t have a power meter or cadence sensor on the bike when I did Maryland in 2015 so the only stat I have from that is how long it took.
Wheels are Flo 60/90 with the wheel builder aero jacket. Tires are the GP 4000 II or whatever its called. I don't see the benefit in paying near $100 a tire for the GP 5000. I run regular butyl tubes. I'm a little scared of latex ones and flatting. Piece of mind is worth something.
The biggest change I see for you is figuring out your elbow position under your shoulders. It’s possible that you just have really long legs but when I look at this picture your body angles are good but for my comfort perspective that’s not very relaxed. The two options are to either move the seat forward, or shorten the stem a bit to bring the elbows back. Head over to TtBikeFit to see some examples.
I would be mildly concerned about your cockpit if the bolts are all seized up. Depending on how long they have been that way it’s possible they may not be very resilient at this point. Something to think about.
The only other change I would make to your set up is going with wider tires. Something like 25s would allow you to run the middle lower pressure and get a few more watts out of your current set up and make the ride more comfortable.
@Coach Patrick
My elbows/arms start in the position you drew, but work their way foward over time sliding from sweat. Then I move em back. Wash, rinse, repeat. I have a history of shoulder injuries from a lifetime of swimming and surgery to try and fix the left one. Was supposed to do the right as well, but the recovery was so bad I decided to not do it. Often I find the pressure on the shoulders when properly propped up on the elbows leads to shoulder pain so I don't mind when they slide forward a bit.